The Assembly met at 13:30 with the Llywydd (Elin Jones) in the Chair.

I call Members to order.

1. Questions to the First Minister

The first item on our agenda this week is questions to the First Minister, and the first question is from Dai Lloyd.

Tidal Energy in South Wales West

Dai Lloyd AC: 1. Will the First Minister make a statement on the development of tidal energy in South Wales West? OAQ53834

Mark Drakeford AC: We continue to work with partners across Wales, particularly in South Wales West, to develop a strong and positive future for the marine energy industry whilst preserving our rich marine biodiversity. Tidal energy remains an area in which Wales could lead the world.

Dai Lloyd AC: Thank you very much for that response. As you know, in a meeting of the scrutiny of the First Minister committee recently, I raised my concern that the world's first test centre for the development of materials for tidal energy is now being built in Scotland. There is a risk that we in Wales are losing momentum, therefore, in terms of putting ourselves in the vanguard in this field. The Swansea bay tidal lagoon is an opportunity for Wales to become a global leader, but with the London Government having turned its back on Wales once again, the Welsh Government, in my view, needs to show clear leadership on this issue. Now, with the work of the Swansea bay region task and finish group coming to end, it was suggested that something may emerge from that that would seek support from the Welsh Government. Can you expand on any recent discussions on this point, and to what extent is the Welsh Government considering co-production in this regard?

Mark Drakeford AC: May I thank Dai Lloyd for that question? I remember the question that he posed at the scrutiny committee. Of course, we continue to work with the city council's taskforce, and we look forward to receiving its report when it's ready. As has been true over the years, the Welsh Government is ready to participate in the project and to contribute to the capital costs of building the Swansea bay tidal lagoon. The problem, of course, Llywydd, is with the cost of the electricity. In that field, it is the responsibility of the United Kingdom Government to announce a scheme that can support the sector with the electricity costs. It is the United Kingdom Government that commissioned the report initially, so they must be accountable for not implementing the clear recommendations of their own report.

Suzy Davies AC: First Minister, I recently chaired a policy forum. Tidal Lagoon Power were there and they spoke about the work that they're doing to encourage businesses to buy energy from them in order to provide a future for the lagoon project. Welsh Government's national procurement service states that it collaborates with public organisations to use collective buying power to get a good deal for Wales, whether it's supply teachers, fuel, computers or sandwiches. Now, we know that the strike price is a question that has threatened this project. So, how can the work done on the national procurement service here on collective buying help make the case to organisations that it could be good value to buy energy from a tidal energy source like the Swansea bay tidal lagoon?

Mark Drakeford AC: Well, Llywydd, I understand the point that Suzy Davies is making, and I've heard arguments made by those involved in the scheme in Swansea that the way to deal with the failure of the UK Government to have a contract-for-difference approach to the electricity that will be produced by any lagoon is to spread the cost of that amongst a large number of public and private sector buyers of that electricity. And I understand the case that they are making. But, surely, the real answer is that the UK Government should recognise that this was always to be a demonstration project, that it is inevitable in nascent technologies that the price of electricity produced would be higher than it otherwise would be in the marketplace, and, just as previous Governments were willing to do in the fields of solar and wind, that they must find a tariff for marine energy—not simply tidal lagoon technology, but marine energy—that allows those new technologies to be attempted and, as we would see it, to thrive here in Wales. That's the right way to do it. Spreading the cost amongst public and private sector buyers here in Wales will only go so far, and will, in the end, result in Welsh citizens having to subsidise a cost that always ought to have been the responsibility of the UK Government.

David Rees AC: First Minister, Dai Lloyd pointed out that the energy proposals of the tidal lagoon could create a new sector of industry across the south Wales region and, clearly, also support other industries there, including the steel plant in Port Talbot. Following last Friday's announcement of the joint venture collapse that is likely to happen between Tata and Thyssenkrupp, this is now a possibility of actually where we can see steel being used from the Port Talbot plant in a project that would give benefits not just to the region, but to the whole of Wales with energy. Will you therefore go back to the UK Government with the message that this is a possibility of how the UK Government can help the steel industry, as well as the tidal lagoon and tidal energy?

Mark Drakeford AC: I want to thank the Member for making that important point, and for taking the opportunity, which I know he does whenever he has that opportunity, to speak up for the steel industry across Wales and in his own constituency. The case for the tidal bay lagoon was never in the relatively small number of jobs that were directly to be involved in the project—that's a point that the Secretary of State for Wales tried to make when trying to excuse the UK Government's decision not to go ahead with the scheme. The jobs were always to be created in those supply chains and those other manufacturing possibilities that go with a new industry that can be born here in Wales. And of course there will be potential for Welsh-produced steel to be used in that construction. And I'm very happy to give the Member an undertaking that we will write again to the UK Government, making the case that he's just put to me, in this new context.

The Support Available to Haemophiliacs and their Families

Mick Antoniw AC: 2. Will the First Minister make a statement on the support available to haemophiliacs and their families in Wales? OAQ53881

Mark Drakeford AC: I thank the Member for that question. Services available to people in Wales with haemophilia include specialist physiotherapy, psychology, social services and access to latest treatments. In addition, the Welsh infected blood support scheme provides a package of financial and other measures for people affected by infected blood.

Mick Antoniw AC: First Minister, you will recognise, as most of us here do, that the contaminated blood scandal is one of the great and terrible scandals that's occurred—admittedly, well before devolution, but one where there is a legacy with us to this day. You'll also be pleased, I'm sure, to welcome the commencement, at long last, of the contaminated blood inquiry, which has started to take place. And I'm sure you will also welcome the actual work that Julie Morgan has done with Haemophilia Wales, and with the families and the victims throughout Wales, and the work she's done with the cross-party group. But, First Minister, as the inquiry started, the UK Government announced a financial package of support—until it turned out that that financial package only applies to England. It appears that Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland are an afterthought and are not included within it, that there is no new money, no new funding, no new consequential. And this, First Minister, must be one of the most cruel and reckless activities by the UK Government—raising expectations while not providing any financial support. First Minister, will you urge the UK Government firstly to ensure that there is new money—proper money—to fund these people who deserve it, and that there is proper provision for the widows? And can you inform this Chamber what discussions, what contacts, you have had from the UK Government, because they are certainly writing in correspondence that there are negotiations about to start? And will you also arrange to meet with the cross-party group—or members of your Government to meet with the cross-party group—so that they can be involved in any forward planning, any decision-making process, but also for an explanation as to where we are with this inquiry and with the issue of support for victims?

Mark Drakeford AC: Llywydd, can I thank the Member for those very important questions? Let me begin by agreeing with him that, of course, we welcome the establishment of the inquiry, chaired by Sir Brian Langstaff. I'm pleased to be able to report to the Chamber that the Welsh Government has secured core participant status in the inquiry, which gives us extrarights of access to the inquiry, and the inquiry, I understand, intends to come to Wales on 23 July and will spend four days here taking evidence directly from those affected and those infected in the contaminated blood scandal, and we will do whatever we can as a Welsh Government to assist people to make sure that they can put their case to the inquiry.
But to go to the specific point the Member raised, on 21 January this year a meeting was held, chaired by the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster, at which it was agreed that there was a need for a UK-wide approach, with parity for all those affected, and that meeting was attended by Scotland, by Wales, and by UK Ministers, and we came away from that meeting having signed up to that proposition and made efforts to secure further meetings beyond 21 January. However, on 30 April—the first day of the infected blood inquiry—the UK Government made a unilateral announcement of additional funding for English patients only. There was no consultation, there was no prior ministerial notice, and it was a breach of the agreement that had been reached on 21 January. We since had a letter from a junior Minister at the Department of Health. It takes your breath away, really, when she says to us, 'I believe', she says, 'That we could all benefit from greater dialogue and co-operation on these matters'. It beggars belief, really, that such a letter could be sent to us when they had done exactly the opposite. The campaigners, the charities and campaign groups who had been part of the meeting on 21 January have since written to the Prime Minister saying that their understanding was that those discussions were for the whole of the United Kingdom. 'We assume', they said, 'That the decision involved devolved administrations and have learned with a mixture of disappointment, anger and frustration that that has turned out not to be the case'.
Now, Llywydd, during the first decade of devolution, the Government at the UK level observed scrupulously the agreement that anything that had happened prior to devolution was a cost on the UK Government. Things that have happened since devolution, of course, are a cost on us here. The awful scandal in contaminated blood happened many, many years before devolution and the devolution rules seem to me unambiguously to require that if money is provided by the UK Government for patients in England, then the same help must be available to patients throughout the United Kingdom, and we will continue to make that case as vigorously as we can with UK Ministers.

Janet Finch-Saunders AC: First Minister, as part of the inquiry work taking place here in Wales, could you provide some clarity, perhaps, as to when pharmaceutical professionals in Wales could be expected to administer the trialled recombinant, laboratory-made factor products such as Fc-fusion, PEGylation and albumin fusion, and also advise what work this Government is doing with patients here in Wales in terms of communication as to how these drugs might actually make a big difference to their lives going forward?

Mark Drakeford AC: Well, Llywydd, on 6 March, my colleague Vaughan Gething provided a written statement to the Assembly, setting out a fair and comprehensive package of additional support for families and individuals here in Wales. We believe that that went some way to meeting the concerns of those families. I'm happy to write to the Member on the specific question of when pharmaceutical professionals will be able to administer new forms of drug therapy, but we have been talking in this question about something more fundamental than that. We've been talking about financial support to people who have been infected by a failure on the part of the national health service nearly 40 years ago that will allow them to live decent lives at this point in their life cycle, and, while there are other things that we want to do, that fundamental issue deserves to be tackled right across this Chamber.

Questions Without Notice from the Party Leaders

Questions now from the party leaders. The Plaid Cymru leader, Adam Price.

Adam Price AC: Diolch, Llywydd. First Minister, a month ago you told the BBC that in the event of a crash-out Brexit, there would be food productsthat would not be available to the public in supermarkets. You said you didn't believe that this would lead to food shortages to individuals, but that the economic impact would be devastating to the food sector, particularly to businesses relying on fresh produce. Can you confirm that every frozen and chilled storage warehouse in Wales is already full to capacity, even with the current Brexit delay?

Mark Drakeford AC: Well, the Member makes the important point, Llywydd. I repeat what I said a while ago, that as far as the shops are concerned, people will not have the range and the choice of products that they have come to enjoy during our membership of the European Union if we leave the European Union without a deal. And those in Wales who rely on producing food that is exported to the European Union will equally find their businesses put at risk if they suddenly face new barriers—not of tariffs but of the non-tariff variety—that will mean that there will be a very significant threat to large parts of Welsh food producers. I don't want to give the Member a definitive answer without being certain that I have it properly in front of me, but my understanding is probably close to what he was suggesting—that the food sector is already using whatever capacity it has to prepare against the day when we leave the European Union without a deal.

Adam Price AC: I can confirm that the cold storage sector in Wales is full to capacity—it has been, I believe, for some months, and, First Minister, you should be aware of this yourself because your own Government, prompted by concerns within the sector, commissioned a study before Christmas into cold storage capacity in Wales that was completed in January. Now, why have you refused to publish that study, and given the understandable public concern, will you commit to doing so now?
In a response to a written question from me, asking what representations you had received as a Government about a potential lack of capacity for cold food storage facilities in Wales, the Minister for Environment, Energy and Rural Affairs rather pointedly replied that you had only received a representation from one business within the sector. Can you confirm, First Minister, that there are only two companies in the sector in Wales and the one you received representation from—Wild Water Group—operates two of the three cold storage facilities for food in Wales? Can you confirm specifically that they have asked you to urgently invest in the development of a new storage facility because of the pressure Brexit has already put on the food sector and supply chain in Wales? You've done precisely this for medical supplies. Given the lack of warehouse capacity in that area, why not do the same for food, given the devastating impact you yourself claim the pressure on supply chains Brexit will cause?

Mark Drakeford AC: Well, Llywydd, just to say that I'm not aware of any request that has come directly to me to release a report. I'm very happy to look to see the status of that report and if it was intended for wider circulation.
My colleague Lesley Griffiths has met the retail consortium this morning and received assurances from them about the steps that they are taking in relation to making sure that there are supplies of food available here in Wales. The Member is of course right to say that in the field of medical supplies we have found storage space to ensure that there is continuity of supply, but for the Government, we always have to balance spending money, which is in short supply, on things that we are certain we will need, should we find ourselves leaving the European Union without a deal, against those many other calls on our EU transition fund that is about preparing Welsh businesses and Welsh public services for the long-term future the other side of Brexit.
I can sure the Member that we keep all possibilities under regular review, and if we were convinced that it was necessary to secure further storagefacilities for the purposes that he's outlined, then we would give that absolutely serious consideration. We've not been convinced of the case so far, but that doesn't mean to say that we wouldn't continue to consider it if further and better information became available.

Adam Price AC: Can I say, then, First Minister, I asked the Minister that is responsible to publish this study. You, as First Minister, are responsible for the Government as a whole, but I'm asking you again now: will you publish that study, because I think the public have a right to know? I can also tell you, First Minister, I'm in possession of a number of letters from companies within the food sector all claiming that the failure to invest in cold storage facilities will have serious adverse consequences now. The managing director of one leading Welsh food company expresses, and I quote, their concern with regard to a serious shortage of both chilled and frozen storage facilities within Wales. The supply chain director of another says it is imperative that we have more cold storage options in the local area to be able to continue to compete. Kepak, which employs 700 people at the St Merryn meat plant in Merthyr says this:
If there is no increase in storage capacity in Wales, we may have to consider transferring some production from Merthyr to a site in Cornwall, which could have a negative impact on employee numbers in Merthyr.
And, furthermore, the National Sheep Association has said that without long-term cold storage facilities for lamb, the effects of a 'no deal' Brexit could be catastrophic.
So, can I ask you, First Minister, given that you yourself have said that a 'no deal' Brexit could have a devastating impact on the food sector, given that hundreds of jobs are at stake now, the future of Welsh farming is at risk and the security of food supply in Wales may itself be jeopardised, why on earth won't the Welsh Government invest the £3 million to £4 million it's estimated that's needed to plug the gap in cold chain supply? And why are you putting your faith in the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs and companies over the border, rather than coming up with a Welsh solution to a Welsh problem that you have exacerbated through the usual dose of complacency, denial and inaction?

Mark Drakeford AC: It's hard to know, Llywydd, where to begin, where you have to try and pick the bones of a sensible question out of the normal hyperbole that the leader of Plaid Cymru cannot deny himself. So, there was a sensible question in the middle of everything that he wrapped it up in and here's a sensible answer for him: I've said to him already that I'm happy to review the report to see if it was intended for publication, and if it is, then I'm very happy to think of doing that.
As far as cold storage is concerned, it is one of—it is one of—a whole range of things that we discuss with the industry, and which the industry says they would need in order to be able to survive the catastrophic impact of a 'no deal' Brexit. If this is the top priority for the industry, in the way that the Member attempts to suggest, then I'd be happy to hear it directly from the industry. And if that's what they say to us, then we will of course discuss that with them as part of the way that we go about the sober business of Government, which is to work alongside those people in Wales who would be affected by a 'no deal' Brexit, to hear from them about where they think the investment that we can make alongside them would best be put to use, and if cold storage turns out—from them, rather from him—to be their top priority, then we will certainly work with them on it.

Leader of the opposition, Paul Davies.

Paul Davies AC: Diolch, Llywydd. First Minister, can you tell us how well your Government carries out due diligence in relation to supporting businesses?

Mark Drakeford AC: Well, Llywydd, the Welsh Government supports hundreds of businesses across Wales every day. We carry out due diligence, of course, on applications for funds that come to us, and we continue to remain in close contact with those companies during the period that we offer support to them. Does that mean that nothing ever goes wrong? Well, of course it doesn't.

Paul Davies AC: Well, let me tell you how your Government undertakes due diligence. Since 2010, the Welsh Government has wasted millions and millions of pounds on bad loans and poor business decisions. Canolfan Cywain received £3.4 million, and what happened? It closed. Main Port Engineering received £650,000 and went into administration. First Minister, I'd like to look closer at one company in particular, 'ku-kd dot com'—or kukd.com. Now, the investigation into the awarding of a £1 million grant to kukd.com from the Welsh Government was announced in September 2016, yet almost three years later, we are still waiting for the report to be published into this issue. This isn't the first time we've questioned your Government's accountability and for being less transparent with us, First Minister. A long line of poorly managed projects have fallen far short of expectations and have dented the confidence of taxpayers. Let's not forget the further misjudgements by the Welsh Government: Pinewood studios, the Circuit of Wales project, the underselling of land connected with the regeneration investment fund for Wales, risky business investment in Kancoat, and irresponsible selling of Welsh timber by Natural Resources Wales. Now, given you claim that you undertake due diligence as a Government, and in the interests of transparency, will you now commit today to publishing the report into kukd.com as soon as possible, so that we in this Chamber can properly scrutinise the actions of your Government?

Mark Drakeford AC: Llywydd, unlike the Member and, presumably, his party, we on these benches believe in investing in businesses here in Wales. I certainly don't apologise, for a single moment, for the fact that successive Welsh Governments have seen it as their duty to assist Welsh firms, to help them to grow to create work here in Wales, and if you're going to do that on an entirely risk-averse basis, where you're never willing to take a chance on a company that might turn out to be a really important part of our economic future here in Wales, then, of course, you can eliminate every possibility of something going wrong by never doing anything. If that's the policy of his party, he should tell us here. If he doesn't believe that we should ever be prepared to invest in a business that may, in the end, not turn out to do everything that both it says to us, our expert panels who review every single one of these cases and the decisions that Ministers make, then people in the future will know that were his party ever to find itself in a position to make decisions here in Wales, then they wouldn't be a Government prepared to do those things that allow businesses here in Wales to prosper.
The Member said to me that there was a lack of transparency and then proceeded to reel off a list of things that he could only possibly know as a result of information that the Welsh Government itself had placed in the public domain. My colleague Ken Skates says that he has no difficulty in publishing the report to which the Member referred, so there will be another report that he will be able to read, and we look forward to his views on transparency when another piece of information that is only available because this Government is prepared to make it available falls into his hands.

Paul Davies AC: Well, this is about transparency and accountability, First Minister. We have waited three years for this report. Why on earth hasn't this report been published until now? So, I take it from the answer you've just given me that he will be publishing this report in due course, but that wasn't clear from your answer. Now, there are still—[Interruption.] There are still serious questions about the relationship between the Welsh Labour Party, former Welsh Government Ministers and kukd.com. Now, in an article by WalesOnline published on 4 November 2015, the then economy Minister wrote that, and I quote,
'Welsh Government support for this project has ensured another business founded by Mr Hussein will be headquartered in Wales.'
However, on 17 November 2015, Welsh Government officials met with kukd.com to discuss their ongoing business difficulties and falling job creation. Then, 10 days after this meeting, kukd.com were a principal sponsor of a Welsh Labour gala dinner at which senior management of kukd.com and senior Government Ministers were present. I put it to you, First Minister: transparency and accountability and openness should be at the heart of politics and decision making in Wales. Given that the report into kukd.com has not yet been published—but I welcome the fact that I think you said in your answer perhaps you will be publishing it—can you confirm that the investigation into this company will be looking at whether or not due diligence was thoroughly undertaken and what will you and your Government be learning so that taxpayers' money is spent wisely in the future?

Mark Drakeford AC: Well, I've—. I said in my last answer, Llywydd, that, once the report is cleared for publication, it will be published and the Member will be able to read it and see everything that is covered in it. I sat in a meeting of the UK Cabinet in which the £30 million that has had to be paid to Eurotunnel in compensation for decisions that his party has made in Westminster, in addition to the contracts that have now been cancelled by his Government—£80 million; £80 million thrown away on that one issue. I don't need to listen to holier-than-thou speeches from the leader of the opposition, because if I wanted to look for where money is thrown away by public authorities, I need look no further than his party and its handling of that one single matter. There is a record number, Llywydd, of businesses now headquartered in Wales, and that wouldn't be the case if it were not for the policies that this Government pursues of assisting Welsh businesses, in investing in them where there is a strong case for doing so. And, where those investments don't turn out to deliver what we had all hoped and had been advised was most likely to be received from them, then of course—of course—we are committed to learning the lessons from those experiences, and that's why the Member was able to identify those instances that he started talking about this afternoon.

Leader of the UKIP group, Gareth Bennett.

Gareth Bennett AC: Diolch, Llywydd—[Interruption.]

Gareth Bennett, continue and ignore the rest of the Chamber.

Gareth Bennett AC: First Minister, sometimes I return to subjects here in the Chamber that I have enquired about in the past, because it appears that nothing is happening. We seem to have reached this stage with Cardiff Central railway station. This is a major transport hub, of course, not just for people in Cardiff but for people throughout Wales, and users will know that there is a lack of room at the station, particularly when there are major events in Cardiff, when people tend to get crammed together in the station like tinned sardines. The Welsh public have been promised an upgrade of the central train station for some time. When do you think we are likely to get it?

Mark Drakeford AC: Well, Llywydd, the Member is right to point to the fact that Cardiff railway station is a very busy transport location; 40 per cent of all rail journeys in Wales begin or end at Cardiff station. That gives you an idea of just how important it is to people in Cardiff but also the across the whole of Wales. Now, investment in Cardiff station is a matter not for the Welsh Government but for the UK Government. We've referred already this afternoon to Mr Grayling and his outstanding success as a Minister. On the long list of things that he has failed to attend to is the case for upgrading Cardiff Central railway station. Now, we have made the case time and again to him to persuade the UK Government to give Wales a fair share of the investment in the railways that we would get if you simply gave us the share that our railway network represents of the UK network as a whole. We get nothing like a fair share. We don't have the voice that we need in London speaking up for Wales to guarantee that we would get it, and so we have to work even harder to persuade the transport Minister in the UK Government not to add this to his lengthy list of failings.

Gareth Bennett AC: Thank you for your engagement with the question and thank you for your engagement with many of the questions that I've asked you. Now, unfortunately, I'm not here to scrutinise Chris Grayling and the UK Government; I'm here to scrutinise you and your Government. You have made this case before of the lack of investment, which—I appreciate the point that you're making. Unfortunately, it doesn't help users of the railway station, who are still waiting for some kind of development work to begin. Now, a wider reflection on how your Welsh Government operates might take in the fact that every week you or your fellow Ministers tell us that they're in some kind of funding dispute with the UK Government. We had the absurdity recently of Welsh residents not being let in for treatment at a hospital just across the border in Chester because of this. The whole point of having a Welsh Government here at the Assembly is supposed to be that things work better for the people of Wales. To the neutral observer, it might appear that all that happens in reality is that you and your Ministers run an operation that does not benefit the people of Wales at all, because all that you do is waste time blaming your lack of action on funding decisions taken at Westminster and Whitehall. First Minister, don’t the people of Wales deserve something a bit better from you?

Mark Drakeford AC: Well, Llywydd, I don’t see how the Member makes any claim at all to be what he refers to as a 'neutral observer'. I hope that his remarks on Cardiff railway station are an indication that he will join us in calling for the devolution of those responsibilities, so that we could discharge them directly here in Wales. I’m not sure if that is his party’s policy, but, if it were, I’d be very glad to know it.
And, where we are able to act, as in the bus station alongside the railway station in Cardiff, then it is the Welsh Government that has acted to ensure that the funding is available and the plan is in place and that the bus station will be developed in a way that, provided we get the investment from the UK Government, that will turn into the transport hub that we have always wanted to see, with an interchange between different forms of public transport right here in the centre of our city.
As far as the point that he ended with, about the Countess of Chester, let’s be clear: that was a decision of the Countess of Chester—a unilateral decision by that provider, which we have now had to spend weeks unravelling and putting back together again the plan that they had shoved off the wall. Now, you will have seen the statement that the health Minister has put out, explaining how, by taking the actions we have taken, we now have an agreement through the Department of Health that will make sure that the Countess of Chester goes on treating Welsh patients. But the decision not to treat Welsh patients was unilaterally and, as I would say, irresponsibly made by them, and certainly not by us.

Question 3 [OAQ53866] is withdrawn. Question 4—Mandy Jones.

Engagement in Local Democracy

Mandy Jones AC: 4. Will the First Minister make a statement on what the Welsh Government intends to do to encourage more engagement in local democracy? OAQ53858

Mark Drakeford AC: I thank the Member for that question.The local government and elections Bill will include measures to encourage engagement with local democracy in Wales by extending the franchise, promoting transparency, diversity and wider engagement.

Mandy Jones AC: Thank you for that answer.First Minister, we are currently celebrating 20 years of this institution with a clarion call for more Assembly Members. I see that Scotland, with its population of nearly 5.5 million, has fewer councillors than Wales, with our population of just over 3 million. In my view, we are overrepresented in Wales. First Minister, how can you square the call for more AMs with the taxpaying public when literally nothing—[Interruption.]

Ignore noises off and just carry on with your question.

Mandy Jones AC: I do come to the committee.
First Minister, how can you square the call for more AMs with the taxpaying public when literally nothing is being done to reduce the number of councillors and local authorities?

Mark Drakeford AC: Well, Llywydd, I don’t think the basic premise of the supplementary question is true, because, in fact, the number of councillors in Wales has gone down as a result of changes brought about by the independent organisation that reviews these matters on our behalf. But I don’t accept myself the basic premise of what the Member said. I don’t think Wales is overrepresented. In fact, there are many studies that demonstrate that, compared to other and very successful parts of Europe, we have less of a representative democracy here in Wales, and it’s my view—it isn’t shared by all Members, I understand—that, 20 years into devolution, the responsibilities that this body now discharges on behalf of people in Wales mean that going on trying to do that successfully with 60 Members, the number we started with when the responsibilities, the range and depth of responsibilities, was so different that it no longer measures up to the responsibilities that are carried out on behalf of people here in Wales, and that the case made in the McAllister review for an increase in Assembly Members was well made and doesn’t depend, I believe, on reducing other forms of representation in Wales in order to achieve that.

Mark Isherwood AC: Welsh Government has proved averse to implementing the Localism Act 2011's community rights agenda, which would help community engagement. In 2012 the Welsh Government rejected the Wales Council for Voluntary Action's 'Communities First—A Way Forward' report, which found that community involvement in co-designing and co-delivering local services should be central to any successor tackling poverty programme, and, although the well-being objectives in the 2015 Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act include people contributing to their community being informed, included and listened to, too often this hasn't happened either because people in power don't want to share it, or because of a failure to understand that delivering services this way will create more efficient and effective services. So, what action do you and your Government propose to encourage more engagement in local democracy by turning the ambition in the well-being of future generations Act in these areas into understanding and delivering?

Mark Drakeford AC: Well, Llywydd, I am completely committed to the notion that public services in Wales should be co-designed and co-delivered with those people who use them alongside people who provide them. The Member makes a fair point, that, at the heart of these things, often, are power relationships and that sometimes we have to work hard to persuade professional workers that they can share some of the power and the authority that they have at their disposal with people who use those services and that that doesn't represent a threat to them and is very, very likely to lead to better outcomes for the people who they are there to serve. I don't think that that requires specific pieces of legislation to bring it about, because I think it is a cultural shift in the way that people who provide services think of the relationship between what they do and the people who come through their door, regarding those people as assets, as people who have strengths, as people who have something to contribute to the way that services are provided, and this Government is committed to that as a principle throughout everything that we do in the services for which we are responsible in Wales.

Major Events

John Griffiths AC: 5. What strategy will the Welsh Government follow to build on the success of hosting major events in Wales? OAQ53874

Mark Drakeford AC: I thank John Griffiths for that. We're committed to building on Wales's recent success in hosting major events. We work with partners in Wales, the UK and internationally to identify events with the potential to grow, and to pursue new opportunities for attracting major sporting and cultural events to all parts of Wales.

John Griffiths AC: First Minister, the Newport marathon on the first Sunday of this month was an outstanding success, building on the achievements of the previous year. There were some 6,000 runners in the marathon, the 10k and the family fun run, a carnival atmosphere in Newport, the women's marathon was won by a Newport woman, which was very pleasing for all the locals, and it really did encourage local people to think about running and getting more active. It works with other regular events like the two park runs in Newport, which see several hundred people every Saturday morning getting more fit and active and enjoying a very healthy start to the weekend. So, I'd be very pleased if you could recognise that success, First Minister, and also the importance in terms of the profile of Wales and Newport, the spend it brings into Wales and Newport, with hotels fully booked, restaurants, cafes and shops very busy, and also perhaps to look at how Welsh Government can continue to work with Newport City Council and key partners to build on the success of the first two Newport marathons for future years.

Mark Drakeford AC: I thank John Griffiths for that. He's absolutely right that the second Newport Wales marathon was a terrific success, both in the numbers of people that it attracted to that mass participation event, but also in the way in which it was televised to other parts of the United Kingdom and beyond. The Welsh Government committed ourselves to investing in the Newport Wales marathon last year, this year, and we will do so again next year. We want to help develop the event's ambition to become the national marathon for Wales and, of course, John Griffiths is right that, beyond the event itself, such events adds to the profile of the area. It's not the only major event that Newport is involved in in a sporting sense. Glamorgan cricket club, Llywydd, are playing a county championship match in Spytty Park today for the first time in many decades—that's a major event in many of our diaries here. And, of course, Newport County embark on the latest of what has been such a fantastic run of success. We wished them well across this Chamber earlier in the season; I'm sure we do that again this afternoon.

Rhun ap Iorwerth AC: I don't want people to feel that they are missing out, but there is one major event that can only be held in my constituency, and I'm talking about the Island Games. I'm very pleased to announce that, this very second, Ynys Môn county council has agreed to underwrite those games from 2025. I'm extremely grateful to the Welsh Government for already agreeing to give a substantial sum of money. The Isle of Anglesey Charitable Trust has also provided a sum of money, as has the international committee of the Island Games. I'm very confident that, through private sources and through local fundraising on Anglesey, we will ensure that we are able to stage very successful games in 2025, and I'm extremely grateful to the councillors for their support today. Does the First Minister agree with me that there is an opportunity through these games to leave a legacy for Anglesey in terms of physical activity and an interest in sport for decades to come?

Mark Drakeford AC: Thank you to the Member for drawing our attention to the fact that the local council and ourselves, as a Government, have supported the bid that has been submitted to attract the games to Ynys Môn in 2025. The games have developed and grown over the years, and now it is a major event in the annual calendar. So, we look forward to working with the local people to bring the games to Ynys Môn and to use the games, as Rhun ap Iorwerth said, to assist and support the economy on the island, to do things in the health area, and also to celebrate the fact that the games have come to Ynys Môn and Wales.

Improving our Food System

Jenny Rathbone AC: 6. What plans does the Welsh Government have to develop a whole system approach to improving our food system? OAQ53876

Mark Drakeford AC: I thank the Member for that question. My colleague Lesley Griffithswill consult on a new action plan for food in the summer of this year. It will address the complexities of food products and consumption, with focus on the delivery of safe and healthy food choices, animal welfare and environmental recovery.

Jenny Rathbone AC: I'm sure we'll all look forward to that consultation, First Minister, but I'm concerned that we have a fragmented system at the moment. We have the health Minister who's awaiting the responses to the 'Healthy Weight: Healthy Wales' consultation, we have the education Minister in charge of school meals—a debate we're going to be having tomorrow—and we have the very welcome focus on food as part of the foundational economy. Yesterday, we had lots of major food retailers stepping up to the plate in committing to halve food waste by 2030. This is, it seems to me, a very complex subject, and I note that in Scotland, there's a lot of pressure to make the good food nation Bill one that delivers in a sustainable, holistic way, and I just wondered how the First Minister plans to bring all of this together within the Welsh Government.

Mark Drakeford AC: Well, I thank the Member for that. She is right to point to the complexity of it all. Llywydd, it seems to me inevitable that almost every Minister in the Welsh Government has an interest of one sort or another in food, and that it's not possible, sensibly, simply to concentrate all those quite different responsibilities—whether it be for school meals, for hospital food, for the food rating scheme, for food businesses, for the environmental impact of food—all in one Ministerial portfolio. That means, in the way that Jenny Rathbone suggested, however, that we have to demonstrate that, as a Government, we are actively organised to make sure that we draw all those different threads together in a coherent way. I want to give the Member an assurance that where there are specific initiatives, such as the 'Healthy Weight: Healthy Wales' programme to which she referred—that while it was published by the health Minister, it was thoroughly informed by officials across the Welsh Government and by discussion with other Ministers. We have a standing co-ordinating group of senior officials in the Welsh Government to make sure that we bring the different activities that we undertake in thefood field together. The food action plan, to which I referred in my original answer, has already been to Cabinet, has already been discussed, and will be further refined now to make sure that it takes into account the views of Ministers across the Government, to make sure as best we can that we deliver what Jenny Rathbone asked for, which is a coherent approach across this complex area.

Expanding Degree Apprenticeships

David Rees AC: 7. What plans does the Welsh Government have for expanding degree apprenticeships? OAQ53873

Mark Drakeford AC: We are providing £20 million to pilot and test degree apprenticeships over the next two years. Following that, when we have that experience, consideration will be given to making the programme permanent.

David Rees AC: Can I thank the First Minister for that answer? Clearly, apprenticeships have been linked to education qualifications for many, many years—ONCs, HNCs—and now the degree apprenticeships are a step forward and very much welcomed. But, I understand in Wales we have two frameworks that are currently operational and we have not yet expanded those two frameworks. I'm very pleased to hear you have a pilot for two years, but when are you going to expand those two frameworks? We haven't got frameworks in health and social care, an area where we know there's a shortage of skills and gaps we need to fill, and beyond that. So, can you give us an indication as to when we'll go beyond the two frameworks we currently have?

Mark Drakeford AC: I thank the Member for that question. Of course he is right and knows from his own direct previous experience that bringing the workplace and study together has very long been part of the way that we provide futures for people in Wales. The degree apprenticeship programme is a new initiative, Llywydd; 210 apprentices became the first to study in the new programme in September of last year and another 210 or so will add to that programme in September of this year. That will test the two frameworks to which David Rees referred. We are looking actively, while that is happening, at other places where that could be expanded, and he's right to point to the field of social care as somewhere where we are always trying to raise the status of the profession through registration and through education and training. We will need to learn from the experience of these initial attempts. There's no point in starting something off in order to learn from it unless you're prepared to take the time that learning requires, but we are actively looking to find other ways in which we can build on what we feel confident will be the success of the programme.

Public Infrastructure Projects

Michelle Brown AC: 8. What assessment has the Welsh Government made of how effective the current funding models for public infrastructure projects are in attracting potential investors? OAQ53880

Mark Drakeford AC: I thank the Member. In funding infrastructure projects, my first aim is always to use the cheapest form of capital first, beginning of course with conventional capital spending. When all public sources are exhausted, we work with potential investors on key infrastructure projects, always ensuring that the public interest comes first.

Michelle Brown AC: Thank you for that answer, First Minister, but as we all know there have been some very significant projects dropped recently, including Circuit for Wales, Wylfa nuclear power station and the tidal lagoon. In each case, these failed because of issues with the funding model. For jobs and quality of life, Wales needs some major public infrastructure projects to actually get off the ground. Going forward, what other funding models are you looking at to attract investment in future projects?

Mark Drakeford AC: I thank the Member for that question. I can assure her that we will be working very closely with the UK Government on the new funding model that it is developing in relation to the potential future of Wylfa and to see whether there is a model that they can devise that would attract investors back to the table to see whether the pause in Wylfa can be unlocked there. As far as the Welsh Government is concerned—and of course the mutual investment model that we have developed has three key projects that we are taking forward—there's been a very strong interest from contractors and from funders and we look still to developing that model in relation to the new Velindre, in relation to the twenty-first century schools programme, and in roads projects as well.

Finally, question 9, Caroline Jones.

The Mental Health of Young People

Caroline Jones AC: 9. Will the First Minister outline the actions the Welsh Government is taking to improve the mental health of young people? OAQ53877

Mark Drakeford AC: The Welsh Government continues to take action across the range of our responsibilities, including working with schools, colleges and the NHS, as well as a range of other partners across the public and third sectors, as we respond to the changing mental health needs of young people in Wales.

Caroline Jones AC: Thank you, First Minister. Young people today face an onslaught of pressures not even dreamt about during our generation. From pressures for how they look on Instagram to the need to spend money to avoid being a 'default' in Fortnite, the burden of the social media age takes its toll. Last week, a survey revealed that six and seven-year-olds are worried about school tests. First Minister, what steps can your Government take to reduce the stresses placed on young people?

Mark Drakeford AC: I thank the Member for that important question. I agree with her that the difficult business of growing up is, in some ways, even more difficult than it has been in the past because of the way in which new media and other things intrude into young people's lives and the pressures that young people can feel to succeed in what can feel like a difficult and competitive world. Where those things are in our hands, as in the case of six and seven-year-olds, then we have acted already to try and make sure that the formative work that is important—because it's very important that formative assessment is made of young people so that they can get the help they need and, as their education progresses, it's tailored to their needs—but to try and bring about those formative assessments in ways that do not have the downsides of making those young people feel under additional pressures. And I know that Caroline Jones will know that we've moved to a new form of testing that will mean it doesn't all have to be bunched into a particular part of a year, that it won't feel like conventional testing, and that individual young people will be able to pursue a series of questions that are right for them and allow their teachers, then, to make an assessment of their progress and to make sure that, as they move ahead, they're able to get the sort of help that we would like to see for them.

Thank you, First Minister.

Questions to the Deputy Minister and Chief Whip

The next questions are questions to the Deputy Minister and Chief Whip, and the first question is from Mohammad Asghar.

Improving Community Safety

Mohammad Asghar (Oscar) AC: 1. What action will the Welsh Government take to improve community safety in the next twelve months? OAQ53830

Jane Hutt AC: The Welsh Government is committed to making our communities safer. Last week, I spoke at the serious and organised crime strategy launch in Wales, and welcomed the contribution of the police, local government and third sector, working together with Welsh Government, to improve community safety.

Mohammad Asghar (Oscar) AC: Thank you very much for that answer, Minister. Religious intolerance is on the rise around the world. In the last two months, we have seen attacks on mosques in New Zealand, on churches in Sri Lanka and on a synagogue in California. In response, the Home Secretary, Sajid Javid, has doubled the amount of funding available to provide protective security for places of worship. Given that the right to freedom of thought, conscience and religion is a basic human right, Deputy Minister, what action is the Welsh Government taking to protect and reassure communities across Wales that they are safe at their place of worship?

Jane Hutt AC: I thank the Member for the question, because on 25 March, following the horrific events in New Zealand, I did write to all our faith communities—in fact, to all the imams across Wales—about protective security at places of worship. What was important was that I enabled those who were affected to liaise with me and officials to see how we could support them, and I drew attention to the places of worship protective security funding scheme. Yes, an uplift was announced by the Home Secretary; the difficulty, of course, is that it's only £5 million over three years and, indeed, it's not going to be available until July. So I'm pressing for that to be brought forward, and I'll certainly make sure that all of our mosques and, indeed, places of worship across Wales are aware of that funding.

Advice Services

David Rees AC: 2. What actions is the Welsh Government taking to ensure that advice services are fully supported for the remainder of the fifth Assembly? OAQ53857

Jane Hutt AC: The Welsh Government will continue its long-standing commitment to fund advice services to ensure there is free, impartial and quality assured advice available for those who need it. This recognises the vital role advice services play in improving the health and well-being of people across our communities.

David Rees AC: Can I thank the Deputy Minister for that answer? Because it's clear that they do play an important role. Last year, we heard the Prime Minister claim that austerity had ended; well, she got it wrong, as she gets everything else wrong. Austerity has not ended and there are many constituents and many people across Wales who continue to suffer under the austerity ideology of this current Tory Government. Now, it's important that the advice services remain in place to support them when they need that support, to stop them falling through the traps into a downward spiral. Therefore, will the Welsh Government commit to ensuring that the funding levels will be maintained at least to the level they're at now, if not improved, to ensure that the services that so many of our constituents do depend upon to ensure that they don't fall into those situations—and their well-being and health is affected by that—are there for helping them when they need that help?

Jane Hutt AC: I thank David Rees for that question because the value to advice providers of longer term grant funding is recognised, particularly in these uncertain and challenging times. And we are clearly maintaining our commitment to the funding of provision of advice services. In fact, funding of around £8.5 million a year, including £2.45 million for the financial levy, and also, in addition to that, we've launched an £8 million single advice fund on 24 April, and we've extended grant agreements, to maintain stability of advice services. But, clearly, we expect to follow this through when we have more certainty on future funding from the UK Government, because advice services have always been a major priority for the Welsh Government, and particularly at this time of austerity and challenging times for the people we represent.

Mark Isherwood AC: You referred to your 24 April written statement to Members during the Easter recess, when you announced the merging of three funding streams and the single advice fund. You said that providers are being encouraged to design and deliver services more collaboratively, and on a regional basis, you're establishing new regional advice networks in partnership with key stakeholders, with inaugural meetings anticipated this autumn. And you also referred to the Welsh Government now receiving a share of the UK financial levy.
How do you respond to concern expressed to me by some of the smaller providers, who tend to fill in the gaps when larger provider queues mean that people facing perhaps bailiffs or eviction need urgent intervention, that their experience is that they've been actively blocked when requesting to join collaborative funding bids locally because larger providers don't want to split their already reduced funding pots with competitors, and that, typically, a large provider can present a collaborative approach to a funder with partners less likely to pose a threat to their status as a lead provider in the area, and their calls to the Welsh Government, as you take this forward, for quotas within bids to compel larger providers to collaborate, not just on delivery, but on the sharing of funding resources, and for smaller ring-fenced pots of funding aimed solely at smaller delivery agents to encourage diversity, innovation, sustainability and specialisation?

Jane Hutt AC: I thank Mark Isherwood for that question because you have referred to my written statement on 24 April. This took forward the implementation plan from the information advice and action plan, which we published back in 2016, and there were 19 actions in that in order to make sure that we can make best use of advice services funding. And I think, as you say, in terms of better collaboration, this new single advice fund is going to enable that to happen. It will encourage better collaboration, improve the efficiency of service planning and delivery models, which is crucial to those smaller organisations that already do receive this funding. It's going to be available, and it is also, of course, ensuring that there will be longer term grant funding, as long as we get that firm commitment from the UK Government in terms of a future comprehensive spending review. But I do believe that this will meet the needs of the information advice action plan, which, of course, was brought together as a result of input from advice providers of all sizes across Wales.

The Impact of Austerity on Equality

Dawn Bowden AC: 3. What recent analysis has the Welsh Government made of the impact of austerity on equality in Wales? OAQ53851

Jane Hutt AC: A recently published Welsh Government report refers to analysis commissioned by the Equality and Human Rights Commission. This shows there is a disproportionate negative impact of the tax and welfare reforms of the UK Government since 2010 on the incomes of several protected groups, including disabled people, certain ethnic groups, and women.

Dawn Bowden AC: Thank you for that answer, Minister. I remain deeply shocked and saddened at the weekly visits to my constituency office from people who find that their lives are becoming harderand are facing an ever-more unequal society, largely due to the impacts of austerity. And in spite of what Theresa May has said, the Tories continue to impose austerity on our communities. Minister, do you agree that, as austerity continues to eat into the social fabric of our communities, destroying the lives of so many people, it is now time for the UK Government to stop the damage and scrap their policy of austerity?

Jane Hutt AC: I certainly do agree with the Member for Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney. And today we have seen this inquiry being announced—the Institute for Fiscal Studies inquiry being announced—into inequalities in the twenty-first century. He's already said in the first publication that the UK has a higher level of inequality than many other developed countries. That's shocking for us here in the UK, in Wales, in the twenty-first century. The levels of poverty across Wales and the rest of the UK are too high. Austerity and the impact of the UK Government's tax and welfare reform policies have fallen disproportionately on our most vulnerable groups. We remain deeply concerned about the fundamental flaws of universal credit. And indeed, the Trussell Trust has just reported that, when universal credit goes live in an area, there's a demonstrable increase in demand in local Trussell Trust food banks. On average, 12 months after roll-out, food banks see a 52 per cent increase in demand, compared to 13 per cent in areas with universal credit for three months or less. So we know, and indeed we know because of the impact of the cuts on our budget, what austerity is doing, not just to our public services, but to the most vulnerable people of Wales.

Suzy Davies AC: Making sure that everyone has access to well-paid jobs or training opportunities is a must, and that certainly applies to people who are disabled, and I think that needs to be a priority for when we're looking for a more equal Wales. I'd be interested to know the Deputy Minister's view of the UK Government's Disability Confident campaign, which helps employers understand that they might actually be missing out on the very best people for their organisation, if all they see is the disability. And we've an excellent champion for this scheme in Swansea—I know some of your frontbench colleagues here will know about Julian John. And you will know, of course, that Swansea is a Disability Confident city. There are over 11,000 employers on the scheme at the moment, but Wales is still under-represented on that. So I'm just wondering if you could share some thoughts on how you think Welsh Government might be able to help employers understand this better, and maybe even commit to making Welsh Government a Disability Confident employer. Thank you.

Jane Hutt AC: Suzy Davies, that is a very important scheme. And we are working with the UK Government, and the department of employment particularly, looking at ways in which we can encourage increased awareness and take-up of that scheme by employers. It's very much a key point that I am discussing with the Minister for Economy and Transport. Because this is about employability, and particularly addressing the needs of disabled people in Wales in terms of employment opportunities. And that is something that, of course, forms part of our national strategy, 'Prosperity for All', because it is about also not just a framework for a whole-Government approach, addressing root causes of poverty, which of course includes disabled people.
I have to say, again, going back to some of the problems that disabled people face at the moment, that they are losing out as a result of UK Government welfare reforms. And we need to make sure that they can access employment, but that also we recognise that there are barriers that we have to address. And of course we are looking for ways in which we can develop a made-in-Wales solution to those problems, but certainly looking at that Disability Confident scheme.

Leanne Wood AC: The Institute for Fiscal Studies report on wealth inequalities in the UK has laid bare the gaping chasm between rich and poor. Among the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development countries, the UK is the second most unequal country, after the United States. This is a disgraceful state of affairs, and it's been now described by the report's authors as a threat to democracy. It's also a damning indictment on various Westminster Governments that have presided over growing inequality, and that is including Labour. It's worth remembering that austerity started under Labour, and the first food banks came about while there was a Labour UK Government. Here in Wales, our hands are tied in many ways, as we lack many of the economic levers that we need to bring about fundamental change. However, Labour in power have hardly set a good example by shutting down the Communities First scheme and failing to replace it. So, in the absence of a dedicated anti-poverty programme, what is your Government's strategy to reduce poverty?

Jane Hutt AC: Clearly, we mitigate against the impacts of poverty and the UK Government's damaging welfare reform programme. I've recently announced, and it's very relevant to the IFS inquiry, that we're going to commence Part 1 of the Equality Act 2010—the socioeconomic duty—by the end of this calendar year, and once that's implemented, this duty will mean that public bodies must consider what they can do to reduce poverty and inequality whenever they make major decisions.
But also, despite the fact that we've had 5 per cent lower budget in real terms as a result of austerity, which is a key point of this question, equivalent to £800 million less as a result of austerity from this Tory Government, we have implemented the discretionary assistance fund, supporting 214,326 awards to the most vulnerable people in Wales. The council tax reduction scheme is supported with £244 million of funding from the Welsh Government. And what's crucial about these policies that this Welsh Labour Government has taken forward is that as a result of the council tax reduction scheme, almost 300,000 vulnerable and low-income households in Wales continued to be protected from any increase in their council tax liability. We're investing £104 million in the Warm Homes programme to improve up to a further 25,000 homes for people on low incomes. Now, what's crucial is that people can see that we, as a Welsh Government here, are working and using scarce resources with those cuts from the UK Government to prioritise ways in which we can mitigate against the impact of welfare reforms and austerity.

The Future Generations Commissioner for Wales

Russell George AC: 4. Will the Deputy Minister make a statement on how the Welsh Government takes the views of the Future Generations Commissioner into account? OAQ53837

Jane Hutt AC: The independent Future Generations Commissioner for Wales role was established to provide advice to Government and public bodies on contributing to the well-being goals. We have taken, and will continue to take into account, the views of the commissioner in the decisions we take.

Russell George AC: Thank you for your answer, Deputy Minister. What assessment will you make of the future generations commissioner's influence and credibility if the Welsh Government ignores her views on the M4 relief road?

Jane Hutt AC: The Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015 is helping us to drive a renewed focus on how the Welsh Government works to improve and engage with the diversity of the population of Wales, and it's important that we work closely with it in terms of implementation of the Act through supporting organisations and, indeed, in sharing best practice across Wales. Of course, the First Minister is currently considering the independent inspector's report on the M4 corridor around Newport project, and his decision will be announced in the first week of June.

Domestic Violence and Abuse in South Wales West

Dai Lloyd AC: 5. Will the Deputy Minister make a statement on domestic violence and abuse in South Wales West? OAQ53879

Jane Hutt AC: The scourge of domestic abuse and violence is intolerable. That's why the Welsh Government introduced legislation and funds services for prevention, protection and support. We are working to making Wales the safest place for women in Europe.

Dai Lloyd AC: Thank you for that response.

Dai Lloyd AC: Now, figures released recently show that South Wales Police receive a phone call every 15 minutes about domestic violence or abuse—a truly shocking figure. One positive move in terms of the identification of domestic abuse has been the Identification and Referral to Improve Safety scheme, the IRIS scheme, which sees GPs and practice staff in Cardiff, the Vale of Glamorgan, Merthyr and Rhondda Cynon Taf trained to spot the signs of domestic abuse through a series of questions. In Rhondda Cynon Taf and Merthyr, where the scheme started in January 2016, there have now been over 500 referrals where previously there had not been any. I believe that this award-winning project needs to be rolled out across the whole of the South Wales Police area, including into areas such as Swansea and Neath Port Talbot and, indeed, across the whole of Wales. To that end, do you agree and, if so, what support is the Welsh Government prepared to provide health boards to help contribute to this vitally important area?

Jane Hutt AC: This is an example of good practice that I know will be shared by the chief constables and the police and crime commissioners. In fact, I'm chairing the policing board on Thursday of this week, and I'm sure that this will be brought to our attention, because it does provide an opportunity for the police and services to work together in delivering on our national strategy on violence against women, domestic abuse and sexual violence, and it is important that we can learn across Wales how services can work together in order to deliver that support and action in terms of tackling violence against women and domestic abuse.

Jack Sargeant AC: Can I thank the Member for South Wales West for tabling this very important question? The Deputy Minister might be aware from recent news articles that councils in England will now have a legal duty to provide secure homes for victims of domestic abuse under recently announced plans. What conversations has the Deputy Minister had with the Minister for housing, looking at the implications of this? Also, what will they be doing to ensure that victims and survivors here in Wales have similar support—building on the fantastic work we've already done by leading the way with the domestic violence Bill—and once and for all ending domestic violence in all its forms?

Jane Hutt AC: I thank Jack Sargeant for that question, because the Welsh Government is committed to ensuring that we have all the services available that are needed for those seeking support because of domestic abuse and violence. Clearly, we are driving this as a result of our national strategy following the Act, and that has led to a more strategic and needs-led approach to commissioning and delivering all services, including refuge provisions and specialist services that are important. So, one of the things we've done—the Welsh Government's recently commissioned the Wales Centre for Public Policy to conduct a review into refuge provision in Wales and make recommendations for both women and men fleeing abuse. That review will look at international approaches and seek input from expert providers. I think funding is crucial as well as legal duties, and it's important that we have invested in Wales—continue to invest—in the Supporting People grant that's paid to local authorities to help vulnerable people find and keep a home or accommodation, including those fleeing domestic violence. That became part of the housing support grant from April of this year and is administered by all the local authorities. That does also give us a much better track record on refuge provision.

The Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015

Caroline Jones AC: 6. Will the Deputy Minister make a statement on how the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015 is improving the lives of people in Wales? OAQ53878

Jane Hutt AC: The Act is improving people’s lives by providing a uniquely Welsh way of tackling the long-term challenges we face. It ensures public bodies focus on preventing problems occurring and working in a collaborative and integrated way, involving people who reflect the diversity of our nation.

Caroline Jones AC: Thank you, Deputy Minister. Yesterday, we learnt that carbon dioxide levels in our atmosphere have reached 415 ppm for the first time in human history—not recorded history; levels haven't been this high since before humans roamed the plains millions of years ago. Unless we take drastic action, future generations will be left with toxic oceans and a dying planet. You seemed at odds with the view of the custodian of the well-being of future generations Act, the commissioner, on the M4 relief road. So, do you believe that your Government is truly committed to the Act and protecting Wales for future generations?

Jane Hutt AC: I think the well-being of future generations Act, as I said, is a unique way, a Welsh way, of tackling long-term challenges. You've mentioned long-term challenges. I think the fact that the Welsh Government was prepared to actually declare a climate emergency—I think probably the first Government that declared a climate emergency—following on only weeks after the publication of a plan, the low-carbon plan for Wales, with 100 actions and priorities that the Minister has not only committed to but is now reviewing and looking at in terms of the opportunities that lie ahead in tackling climate change—. I think what is important in terms of the future generations commissioner and the way that we work together is that we can see the impact that this has had. For example, the revised national planning policy has been reframed, using the Act, and puts placemaking at the heart of the planning system, ensuring that people's well-being is considered as part of the planning process.

Janet Finch-Saunders AC: As you'll be aware, the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015 lists well-being goals, including a healthier Wales. It is my understanding that such goals could be taken into consideration by public authorities, including councils across Wales and the Welsh Government when considering applications to dedicate particular footpaths. Will you, therefore, confirm that there is a duty on planning authorities to take into account the healthier Wales goal when considering the dedication of a highway?

Jane Hutt AC: Local authorities have to take into account the well-being objectives of the future generations Wales Act and consider the long-term impact of decisions that they make, and, of course, that includes all developments. I think what's very important, Janet Finch-Saunders, is that I have mentioned the fact that the national planning policy, which is crucial to these issues, has been reframed using the Act.

Thank you, Deputy Minister.

2. Business Statement and Announcement

The next item is the business statement and announcement, and I call on the Minister for Finance and Trefnydd to make the statement—Rebecca Evans.

Rebecca Evans AC: Diolch, Llywydd. There are two changes to this week's business. A statement on the Wales coast path and on active travel have been added to today's agenda. Draft business for the next three weeks is set out on the business statement and announcement, which can be found amongst the meeting papers available to Members electronically.

Mohammad Asghar (Oscar) AC: Minister, please could we have a statement from the Deputy Minister for culture on what more can be done to protect our important historic monuments from vandalism? Last week, the Roman amphitheatre in Caerleon was once again the target for vandals, with stones being removed and thrown around. Removal of these stones has damaged the structure of this ancient monument and its underlying archaeology. Incidents have also been reported of suspected vandals being abusive and threatening to the custodian of the site. Minister, please could we have a statement from the Deputy Minister on what more we can do to protect such sites from these mindless criminals?

Rebecca Evans AC: Thank you very much for raising this particular case in the Chamber. Of course, vandalism and destruction of protected monuments is thankfully very, very rare, but when it does occur, it's obviously something that's of deep concern and regret to the communities affected particularly, but also to all of us in terms of our Welsh history and our Welsh heritage. If there is an update that the Minister's able to provide in this particular case, I'll ask him to write to you.

Dai Lloyd AC: Trefnydd, in a written statement on 30 April, the Deputy Minister and Chief Whip expressed her concerns with regard to the findings of Her Majesty's Inspectorate report on the Western Bay Youth Justice and Early Intervention Service, published on 28 March this year. The report showed that the amalgamation of youth justice services from Swansea, Neath Port Talbot and Bridgend was poorly implemented, and the organisation created in 2014 has failed to adequately protect the children and young people, and the wider public, in the area. The report found that none of the three local authorities have taken full responsibility for the service, there was inconsistent partnership work, variable quality of casework, and inadequate day-to-day management, and managers and staff were, quote,
'left to firefight and respond to the symptoms of significant systemic problems.'
Essentially, the report finds that it is often impossible to tell if children and young people in Swansea, Bridgend and Neath Port Talbot are being protected at all. Even though youth justice is a non-devolved matter, there are clear links to devolved areas such as social services and early intervention. Now, as Welsh Government officials are involved in discussions with a number of bodies on this matter, will the Welsh Government, therefore, commit to providing an oral statement, focusing particularly on the progress needed and being made against the recommendations contained within this report?

Rebecca Evans AC: Thank you very much for raising this issue. Of course, there is an oral statement tabled for the Assembly for next week on justice blueprints, and this might be an opportunity to raise some of these particular matters with the Minister on that day.

David Rees AC: Trefnydd, obviously, following the announcement last Friday that the Tata joint venture with Thyssenkrupp is at risk and unlikely to go ahead and that they were suspending the process of a joint venture, can we call for an oral statement from the Minister for Economy and Transport—but, actually, I'd prefer it from the First Minister, as I think this is that important—relating to the actions the Welsh Government will take to work with Tata to ensure the future of the steel industry here in Wales? It's a crucial element for the steel industry, and we need an opportunity to ask questions of the Minister to ensure that we understand fully the actions they will take to protect steel in Wales. They've done it so far—the Welsh Government has to be commended on its history of support for the industry—but here we are again, facing another 2016, effectively, following the announcement last Friday, and the workers in Port Talbot, the workers in Shotton, the workers in Llanwern, Orb and Trostre all need to have confidence that there is a future for the industry here in Wales.
On a second point, could we also have a debate in Government time on the shared prosperity fund? In responses to a debate in Westminster Hall, called for by my colleague Stephen Kinnock MP, it was clear the message coming through from the Government was that this shared prosperity is going to be more of an all-UK type of prosperity fund and that we will not necessarily be getting the same type of funding we get now and we won't necessarily be in control of that funding. It's about time now we had a debate here so we can make sure that the whole Assembly has a debate and we're able to send a clear message from this Assembly to Westminster that they should honour the commitments they made and not invent new ways of slicing up the money for their Conservative friends in the English counties.

Rebecca Evans AC: Thank you, David Rees, for raising both of those extremely important issues this afternoon. Clearly, this is a worrying time for those who work in the steel industry across Wales, and, as we stood by our steel industry throughout the crisis of 2016, we will again work collaboratively with the industry and with its supply chains, and also with the recognised trade unions, to support the steelworkers and the communities around them through this important next period.
The Minister for economy, Ken Skates, spoke with the executive director of Tata Steel Europe and also with steel unions on Friday following the announcement, and he'll continue to work closely with Tata to discuss how we can best support the industry in light of the recent announcement. I know it was his intention to issue a written statement today, but I'll certainly make him aware of your request to discuss the issue in person with him.
I'm very taken by your suggestion of a debate on the shared prosperity fund. I think it would be an excellent opportunity for this Assembly to send a clear message to the UK Government that any Brexit shouldn't mean a penny lost or a power removed from Wales, and we've certainly come to some strong conclusions about how the shared prosperity fund should operate in future. I think that sending a strong united message on that would be particularly useful.

Mark Isherwood AC: Can I call for a single statement on support for people with myalgic encephalomyelitis, or chronic fatigue syndrome, in Wales? Last Sunday, as you might be aware, was ME Awareness Day, on 12 May, and this month is ME Awareness Month. I called for a similar statement on 13 November, or last November, after I hosted an event here with the Welsh Association of ME and CFS Support and with ME Support in Glamorgan, and the showing of a film called Unrest, which led to calls for the health Secretary here to address as a matter of urgency the continuing need for improved access to timely diagnosis, for GPs to fully understand the symptoms of the condition, and for the development of a standardised training and awareness programme in Wales.
We also saw a copy of the ME Trust's 2018-21 strategy 'A Vision into Action' paper, which said that parts of the UK, such as Wales, had no specialist services. Unfortunately, the Minister responded by stating she didn't think there was any need for supporting statements. The Minister is pleased with her refill policy and no doubt will be bringing something back to the Chamber in the course of it to tell us how well it's doing. Well, we haven't, as far as I'm aware, yet heard.
I've now been contacted again by Dr Nina Muirhead, who spoke at that event, who has been diagnosed with ME/CFS herself, following glandular fever, who's not only a NHS doctor but an academic working at Cardiff University. She tells me that she's been in touch with the major health conditions policy manager at the Welsh Government, who she believes is now working on policy for major chronic health conditions, including ME/CFS, and she reiterates that, prior to becoming ill herself, she followed the National Institute for Health and Care Excellence guidelines, which perpetuated her misunderstanding of the condition by recommending cognitive behaviour therapy and graded exercise, where, from her experience, there's no psychological component, and exercise, if anything, was making matters worse. She concludes that the reality of ME/CFS is a serious, heritable, neurological condition. I therefore call for a statement and hope that you will be more forthcoming than your predecessor when I called for a similar statement last November.

Rebecca Evans AC: Thank you for raising this this afternoon, and also for the opportunities that you've taken to host events in the past on this particular issue to raise awareness amongst Assembly Members. We do understand the challenges faced by people living with this condition and the impact that it can have on their daily lives, and also the importance of ensuring that the correct advice is available to them and also the correct treatments, and that's why we're working with healthcare professionals and the third sector to strengthen ME services available across Wales. I will ask the health Minister to reflect on your comments this afternoon and to provide you with an update on the latest situation.

Leanne Wood AC: The issue of train overcrowding has been brought to my attention by concerned staff working for Transport for Wales. I know from my own experience that packed carriages during rush hour can be absolute hell. I've been informed that there have been occasions where a guard has refused to take a train further due to severe overcrowding. Now, apart from being dangerous for passengers, it's also leading to heated confrontations with staff, who often bear the brunt of considerable frustration and anger. My contact says, and I quote:
It is a serious concern and I believe that it's only a matter of time before someone is seriously hurt either through accident or anger.
Now, I know that the set-up is a new one, but this has to be dealt with by this Labour Government. Do you agree that safety is paramount? And can we have a statement from the transport Minister to this Senedd setting out that he is aware of these issues and that he is taking swift action to ensure that our trains are safe for passengers, safe for staff and worthy of a developed country in the twenty-first century?

Rebecca Evans AC: Well, of course we do agree that safety is paramount and that's one of the reasons why we've ensured that there are guards on all trains, for example, where we're seeing them stripped away from services in other parts of the UK. I think the best way forward would be for you to write to the economy Minister with the specific examples you've given this afternoon. He'll be able to take them up, then, with Transport for Wales.

Nick Ramsay AC: Trefnydd, as you know, yesterday, BBC Wales carried a story about farmers being unable to recycle their plastic waste due to Wales's only recycling centre, I think, moving from a payment basis to a charge basis for the intermediate operators. I appreciate that the Welsh Government have responded that this is an issue between farmers and the private sector, but there clearly is an impact on the environment and on farmers, indeed, of course, if there is an increase in the disposal of plastic waste on land, either by burying or burning, as has been spoken about. So, I wonder if we could have an update or an intervention from the Welsh Government on this situation.I appreciate that it is an issue within the private sector, but there are consequences for the public sector as well, so I think it'd be good to hear the Welsh Government's further opinion on this, because there is great concern amongst farmers I've spoken to.
Secondly and more optimistically, I'm sure you are aware that yesterday was the Food Awards Wales at the Cardiff City Stadium—a great showcase of Welsh food, and we know the importance of that for tourism. There were two winners from my area—at least two winners—Sugarloaf Catering and Scrumptious Monmouth. But I know that there were also winners from across Wales. I'm sure you'd like to send congratulations to those winners and, indeed, to the runners-up, and perhaps we could hear, at some point, from the Welsh Government an update on the food strategy and how that ties in with tourism and food festivals and the like across Wales. Because Wales has a lot to give on the European and world stage in the food market.

Rebecca Evans AC: Thank you very much. In relation to agricultural polythene, it is the case, as you set out in your contribution, that the disposal of farm plastic is a commercial matter between the farmers, the collectors and the plastic film waste plants that can and do recycle it, and that farmers do have a responsibility to ensure that their plastic is disposed of correctly. The Minister did suggest that you write to her with your concerns, and I'm sure she will respond accordingly.
On the second issue, I'm very happy to congratulate Sugarloaf Catering, Scrumptious and all the other winners at the food awards yesterday. Of course, the food industry is one of the rising stars in the Welsh economy. We've got a huge amountto be proud of in terms of the quality and the provenance that we're able to demonstrate in our food, and we do have a food tourism action plan that brings together those two elements, recognising the important contribution that the food industry can also make to our tourism offer in Wales.

Llyr Gruffydd AC: The Government, as we've already heard today, of course, a fortnight ago declared a climate emergency, and this Assembly made a similar statement too. Now, I would expect that there would be a great deal of activity happening behind the scenes within the Welsh Government to respond to that statement and to clearly demonstrate that that statement is meaningful. I would assume, for example, that we would need to look again at the Government's legislative programme to ensure that that is fit for purpose in terms of meeting the challenge facing us, and that challenge has intensified now, of course, having recognised that it is an emergency. So, it would be good to have a statement from Government outlining any changes to its legislative programme as a result of that statement.
Also, could the Government make a statement to explain how the announcement of a climate emergency is going to impact upon the process of deciding on the M4 relief road in Newport, because, clearly, one would assume that the weighting given to the various factors would shift as a result of that statement?
May I also ask the Government and the Minister for Finance for an opportunity to have an update on the written statement released today? I understand that an error has emerged in terms of the work of Her Majesty's Revenue and Customs on implementing devolved income tax in Wales, to the point where the coding for Welsh taxpayers has been incorrect, with many Welsh taxpayers being coded as being Scottish, and as a result have paid the Scottish tax level rather than the Welsh income tax level. Now, there isn't a great deal of detail in the Government's statement as to how many people have been affected, how this could have happened, and what HMRC is doing to solve this problem. So, some update on that situation, and perhaps an opportunity for us as Members to ask questions, would be something that I would appreciate.

Llyr Gruffydd AC: Could I ask for a statement from the health Minister as well? I read with interest and welcomed the written statement last week in relation to cross-border healthcare arrangements and the agreement that has been reached in relation to the dispute with the Countess of Chester Hospital. There's nothing in the statement that tells us what the nature of that agreement or that compromise is. My understanding from a UK Government ministerial statement is that the UK Government will pay the disputed costs for this year, and that the Welsh Government will then step in and pay it in future years. I'd like to understand—this disputed 8 per cent, apparently, is relevant, of course, in this particular context, but it's relevant as well in every other particular context where we see health services being purchased from across the border. So, are we here running the risk of establishing a precedent where, if the Welsh Government agrees to pay the disputed 8 per cent for the Countess of Chester, then it's opening itself up to having to pay that to the 50 other health trusts and services that provide services to the NHS in Wales? So, it would be good to have an opportunity maybe for either an oral statement from the health Minister or some further information about the exact nature of that agreement, because the financial implications, of course, for our already beleaguered health boards could be very, very substantial.

Rebecca Evans AC: Thank you for raising those various issues this afternoon. The first matter you raised was the issue of the climate emergency that was declared by the Welsh Government, and then you asked specifically about the legislative programme. Of course, the First Minister brings forward an annual statement on the legislative programme, which I believe takes place in June, so he'll certainly be making that statement as normal. The Minister for environment and rural affairs will also be bringing forward a statement to the Assembly on the low-carbon delivery plan, which includes 100 of those actions and priorities in terms of tackling climate change and carbon emissions. On the matter of the M4 relief road, the process has been clearly set out. I'm not going to be drawn into any further comment on it this afternoon, save to say that the First Minister has set out in his written statement the process and the expected timescale for a decision to be made.
With regard to the C code and the issues that that's had in terms of Welsh taxpayers, it is extremely disappointing that this has happened, but it does, I suppose, vindicate the very cautious approach that we did decide to take in terms of our approach to this issue. I have had discussions with HMRC, and the reason that I was unable to set out in my written statement the extent of the issue is because HMRC don't yet know the extent of the problem, because they have to run a number of tests, which they'll be doing in this month, and then further tests again in September to establish those individuals who have been assigned the wrong code by their employer or the person operating the payroll. But I obviously will commit to updating the Assembly and, particularly, the Finance Committee, as soon as I am able to on all of those issues.
The final issue that you raised was the matter of the Countess of Chester, and of course the agreement has been reached for 2019-20 only. But the health Minister has said that he would be happy to write to the health committee with further details and also, then, to make that letter available to all Assembly Members.

Andrew RT Davies AC: Organiser, could I seek two statements, if possible, please? One in connection to press reports on the weekend in the financial papers around developments of the Ford engine plant and, in particular, the Welsh Government's site at Brocastle and the potential for Jim Ratcliffe's company to come there and build a potential 4x4 vehicle to replace the Land Rover model. I appreciate the Welsh Government has been in negotiations. I appreciate those negotiations have been long and they are commercially sensitive, but there are press reports coming out now, obviously, making various views known as to the potential of this application. An update on where the negotiations are and, in particular, what development the Government has in mind for the Brocastle site in particular, where construction has now just begun, would be beneficial for the local community, as well as obviously workers connected with the Ford engine plant, to understand what progress, with the limits of commercial confidentiality, has been made, because, as I said, these negotiations have been going on for some time and the press are now speculating on this.
Secondly, could we have a statement from the transport Minister in relation to what work the Welsh Government is doing around the A4119, and in particular the arterial roads into the A4119, and junction 34 on the M4 up to junction 33? This is a regional transport issue, where people using those roads are literally gridlocked in the morning coming out from the Valleys—Llantrisant, Talbot Green, Pontyclun, and further up—and then on the way home, the traffic is severe to say the least. I appreciate the metro system is on the cards to come forward in the next five, 10, 15 years, but this gridlock, in effect, is happening here and now and is causing a huge amount of distress to drivers and, frankly, in some instances, is very dangerous. People are looking for as many rat runs as they possibly can, through lanes that are totally unsuitable for the volume of traffic, given the gridlock people are finding around the junction 34 and the road A4119. So, a statement over what action the Government is engaging in, with partners such as the transport agency and in particular the local authority, to alleviate some of this congestion would be most welcome.

Rebecca Evans AC: On both of those issues, so the Ford engine plant and also the congestion issues around the A4119, I will ask the Minister with responsibility for economy and transport to write to you in terms of what he is able to say with regard to the Ford engine plant, but then also plans to address the congestion issues and any discussions he's had with other relevant agencies.

Rhun ap Iorwerth AC: I had intended to request a statement on the announcement made today on taxation, and the error with the coding. I'm pleased that that's already been raised, but I do intend to ask a topical question on that issue.

Rhun ap Iorwerth AC: If I could ask for a statement from the Minister for health responding to concerns about an event stakeholders locally have been invited to. It's called, and I quote: 'Cwm Taf Morgannwg safeguarding board's first ever Celebration of Good Practice event'. Now, this follows the damning and distressing report about maternity services in Cwm Taf health board, where mothers and babies certainly were not safeguarded. Whilst recognising that more bodies are involved in this event than just the health board, can I invite the Minister, who of course has rejected calls for his resignation, to at least respond to that invitation and serious concerns locally that have been raised with us that this is entirely inappropriate and deeply insensitive?

Rebecca Evans AC: On the first issue of the C code,I'd be more than happy to take any opportunity to discuss with you or any other interested Assembly Members the latest update and, obviously, to keep Members informed and to share communication that I’ve had with HMRC on this particular issue.
On the matter of Cwm Taf and the safeguarding board area, that obviously is a large area where there is a huge amount of practice going on. I think it is important, especially in difficult situations such as the one that we find ourselves in now, to recognise good practice when we see it and to ensure that those people who are working hard and delivering well in terms of safeguarding feel supported to continue doing that and feel that they do have their good contribution recognised. Because, clearly, this is an extremely sensitive and difficult situation.

I thank the Trefnydd.

3. Statement by the Minister for Health and Social Services: Update on the Dementia Action Plan

The next item, therefore, is the statement by the Minister for Health and Social Services, an update on the dimension action plan. And I call on the Minister to make the statement—Vaughan Gething.

Vaughan Gething AC: Diolch, Llywydd.Next week is Dementia Awareness Week. In February last year, I launched the dementia action plan for Wales. The plan sets out our vision for Wales to be a dementia-friendly nation that recognises the rights of people with dementia to feel valued and to live as independently as possible in their communities. The plan drew heavily upon the experience of people living with dementia and those caring for people with a dementia diagnosis. I'm determined that the lived experience of people living with dementia will continue to guide the delivery of our plan as we take it forward with key stakeholders in health, local government and the third sector.
At the outset, I recognise the pressure on front-line services and the need to make the ambition set out in the action plan a reality. That’s why I announced £10 million a year from the last financial year to support the delivery of the key actions in our plan. I’m clear that the investment of additional resources must lead to a step change in dementia services. That must mean that people most affected feel that improvement as part of their everyday lives. I’m also clear that, in line with our commitment in the Well-being of Future Generations Act 2015, the additional resources will be focused upon prevention.
To ensure the improvements are driven locally and in a joined-up way, £9 million of the additional funding was distributed to regional partnership boards through the integrated care fund. As a result of this funding and our integrated approach, we're now seeing positive and tangible change. For example, there is now additional support available for GP-led clinics to increase diagnosis rates, which, as Members will know, was a key priority and concern within the plan. We’ve also seen an increase in the number of dedicated support workers who play a key role in ensuring person-centred care is delivered.
Since publication of the plan, the number of dementia friends and dementia-friendly communities has also increased. We now have an extra 19 dementia-friendly communities, making up 72 dementia-friendly communities here in Wales, and an additional 38,000 dementia friends trained over the last year as part of the Alzheimer’s Society initiative. And the Welsh Government, of course, continues to provide funding to help support that Dementia Friends initiative. That plays a key role in tackling stigma, improving support in the community and raising awareness and our understanding of dementia.
During the last year, we've seen our first acute hospital in Wales receive dementia-friendly status from the Alzheimer’s Society. Ysbyty Gwynedd is only the second hospital in the UK to receive this status. It recognises the positive action taken by our staff to respond to the needs of the local community.
Another key action in the plan was to develop teams around the individual who provide integrated, person-centred care and support. The plan makes it clear that a one-size-fits-all will not work, and areas need to consider what change is necessary to be able to create services that adapt to what is required as a person’s needs change. Each area is now demonstrating how this is becoming a reality, for instance, through the development of multi-disciplinary teams, with an emphasis on the involvement of allied health professionals to provide a re-ablement approach. Crucially, these teams are able to provide more integrated care through activity that is driven by both the statutory and the voluntary sectors.

Joyce Watson took the Chair.

Vaughan Gething AC: As part of this work we are seeing examples of flexible and enabling respite support, such as flexible outreach, and offering respite options beyond the traditional respite admission to a care home. At the same time, we see an increase in support for those who are in care homes or a hospital setting so that people affected by dementia receive personalised care and support no matter where they are. We have examples of work ongoing in care homes, which further strengthen that person-centred approach, and projects that support planned discharge from hospitals.
In addition to the funding routed through the integrated care fund, Welsh Government support has been provided to the Welsh ambulance services trust. This includes establishment of a dementia team, training and awareness for champions, and the delivery of training for emergency service call takers. WAST has also been involved in establishing an all-Wales blue-light dementia working group, which will work together to share best practice. The aim is to ensure that all of WAST's staff who come into contact with people affected by dementia are trained to understand their needs and how to provide support.
One of the ways in which the plan has helped move the dementia debate forward has been the recognition of the diverse needs of particular groups, for instance people with protected characteristics who may be living with dementia and people who may be able to understand only their first language as their condition progresses. The Welsh Language Commissioner and Alzheimer’s Society Cymru's recent report into Welsh language and dementia has made a number of recommendations and established a task and finish group to oversee these improvements. Welsh Government officials will sit on that group so we can consider any further work that is needed in this area.
Public Health Wales’s 1000 Lives programme is also working with memory assessment services to agree standards and principles that each service will work towards as part of the dementia pathway. That includes pre-diagnosis, assessment period and post diagnosis support and intervention.
Driving the range of improvements we want to see as a result of the dementia action plan and associated additional investment is key. To that end, we've established a dementia oversight of implementation and impact group, which informs, oversees and monitors progress against the action laid out in the plan. I really am grateful to all members of this group, which includes service users and carers, people with the lived experience of living with and working with dementia, for their ongoing commitment and challenge.
Having the right type of workforce is, of course, crucial in this area and we've established a learning and development sub-group, led by Social Care Wales, to establish an enabling workforce approach to dementia care here in Wales. This approach to learning and development will be centred on the principles of the 'Good Work' framework that I had the pleasure of launching in Ysbyty Ystrad Fawr. It puts individuals at the heart of learning and development and focuses upon compassionate practice. All of this is designed to improve care for people living with dementia, their families and their carers.
The dementia action plan signalled that we would create an all-Wales dementia allied health practitioner consultant post to help drive further improvement and to ensure that support and advice is available to health boards and local authorities on their improvement journeys. We've now completed all of the necessary preparatory work, and I'm pleased to confirm that we'll shortly begin the recruitment process for the post, and I expect the successful applicant to be in post by the end of this summer.
Finally, I’m pleased that the Welsh Government has committed to become a dementia-friendly organisation. Over 200 of our staff are already receiving training. It is important that Government helps to lead by example, in recognising our role as a major employer and the positive impact that can have on supporting colleagues, friends and our local communities who are living with dementia.
Given the strong partnership arrangements that we have in Wales I believe we're well placed to continue to create a society that positively supports those faced with a diagnosis of dementia. An ageing society means that the challenges in this area will increase but the first year of the dementia action plan has put in place many of the things that we think that we will need to respond effectively to those recognised challenges. Only by working together can we realise the shared vision for Wales to truly become a dementia-friendly nation.

Joyce Watson AC: I'd like to call Janet Finch-Saunders.

Janet Finch-Saunders AC: Thank you. Thank you, Minister, for your statement. The dementia action plan, of course, promises to improve person-centred dementia services and is based on a number of principles in dementia statements, including the right to an early and accurate diagnosis. Diagnosis, of course, forms an important part of your plan, especially as you even recognise that only around 53 per cent of individuals in Wales with dementia have had a diagnosis. Indeed, it was found that almost 19,000 with dementia remained undiagnosed in 2017-18.
So, in terms of realistic achievements in this area, could you confirm that your commitment in the plan to set targets for health boards to increase diagnosis rates by at least 3 per cent a year has been carried out and is being dealt with? And, once diagnosed, it is essential that there is a flexible support system. As such, the Welsh Government committed to the development of the multidisciplinary teams around the individual.
So, if that's the case, and that has been achieved, could you confirm to the Chamber today that every individual living with dementia that has been highlighted and identified has in fact been provided with a fundamental care plan? Thank you.

Vaughan Gething AC: Thank you for the questions. I set out in my statement and reiterated the importance of diagnosis. It was a particular issue of concern, both from the wider community living with dementia, as well as Assembly Members, in the run-up to the plan. The commitments in the plan remain, about our expectation to see year-on-year increases through the plan. We also have a mid-point review to understand how successful we've been. We'll next have figures available on the increases in diagnosis rates in September of this year. But, as I set out in my statement, we're taking a range of practical measures to try and assist that. In terms of flexible support, again, I set out in my statement a range of the steps that we are taking to provide that flexible support and actually the point about having teams around the individual to understand the needs of that person, what matters to that person, and how that may change over time as the condition progresses.
And, in terms of a guarantee that everything is in place now, I think it would be foolish for me to try and suggest that is in place. This is a continuing journey. And on that journey of improvement we should all recognise that not every single intervention will be delivered successfully. There will be more for us to learn about what we don't get right as well as what we have got right. So, I want to be realistic and honest with people about where we are. It's a journey of improvement. There's huge commitment from our staff across local authorities and the health service in particular, and the third sector. But key to all of that is a commitment of people living with dementia to help inform the work we're undertaking and to be honest partners in both challenging and supporting us on the improvement that we all recognise is required.

Dai Lloyd AC: I'm pleased to respond to this statement from the Minister, which gave an update on the dementia action plan. May I say, first of all, that I have been vice president of the Alzheimer's Society for many years, and I have also been vice president of Forget Me Not dementia clubs recently in Swansea? I also have personal experience of dementia over the past two years, following the death of my father recently, after months of suffering with dementia.
So, in responding to this statement, I want to emphasise the change that's required in services in our communities, having set out my association with the Forget Me Not clubs and the Alzheimer's Society and a number of others who work voluntarily in our communities. And, of course, most of the care for people with dementia is also done on a voluntary basis by families, and their contribution is crucial in this regard. If it were all to fall on social care and the health service, then we couldn't cope with this appalling situation in any way whatsoever, so it's important that we recognise and pay tribute to the contribution and commitment of voluntary carers the length and breadth of Wales in this regard.
And, of course, as the Minister has already said, there is still stigma. People fear discussing dementia. They fear being in contact with people with dementia. That's part of the importance of having that training to become dementia friendly, as the Minister has already mentioned. It's the need for patience. When you are in the queue, paying for something, or waiting to pay for something, behind someone who has dementia, we need patience. We shouldn't be putting pressure on people and hastening them. We need patience and we need to give people time. Because, at the end of the day, much of this is about dealing with the prejudiceagainst dementia and dementia care, because people don't see it as being a physical problem and they see it as a mental health issue. But, of course, dementia is a physical ailment because the brain shrinks. So, that is a physical illness, and dementia deserves equal treatment with other physical illnesses and conditions, and that's what doesn't happen at the moment. If it were dealt with in that way, then we would have the same respect for those suffering with dementia as those with cancer or heart disease.
So, there's a great deal of work to be done in terms of preventing that stigma in our society against those who have dementia, and I would like to hear what the Minister is doing in moving forward with his action plan in order to deal with those issues. Ultimately we are talking about care on the ground and the need for more specific services on the ground.
Social care: the Minister will know my ideas about having a national care service, because the quality of care now is often deficient, can be dangerous or not available at all, and everything then falls on the families. We need more respite care when families are under huge pressure. We need more respite care for them. So, does the Minister have plans specifically to increase the respite care available?
I do welcome what he said about people here in Wales who are first-language Welsh speakers. Of course, as dementia develops, then you lose the ability to speak your second language relatively early. So, we need provision, and we need services in the Welsh language in order to deal with people who are suffering dementia and who are first-language Welsh speakers. They lose their second language, and that happens in all countries where there is more than one language spoken. But, we need a strategy as a matter of urgency to tackle that, because it's our aging population who tend to get dementia. It's not always linked to old age, of course, but there is a substantial percentage of those people who are Welsh speakers, and that's the only language that they have when dementia takes hold, as my own father's experience proved.
So, at the end of the day, I welcome the statement and I welcome the work that's ongoing. But, at the end of the day, as you've mentioned, you need a step change and we need to transform the scale and the quality of the services available on the ground in order to tackle this issue and to provide fairness to our people who have dementia and their families. Thank you.

Vaughan Gething AC: I thank the Member for his comments and questions. I will deal with a range of the specifics that you've provided. But on your last point about the Welsh language provision, in the statement, I've set out the work that has been done jointly, first with the Welsh Language Commissioner and the Alzheimer's Society, and that task and finish group will help to inform us more about what we need to do. And as there is Welsh Government participation in the task and finish group, we will learn through the course of that and not just when we get the final report. Obviously, we'll then expect to respond to that and to understand how we will reform services—not just a central directive from the Government, but, actually, how each of those regional partnership groups will need to think again about how they provide services. This is not a care preference, but a care need, and we do need to reflect that.
On your broader points about recognising the contribution of the voluntary sector, the organisations themselves are involved in organising activities, support and services, as well as advocacy, championing and challenging us, again, to recognise the role of individual carers—often, members of families who go out of their way and give up lots of their life to care for loved ones. And without that, we wouldn't provide not just a service, but the sort of compassion and dignity that we want to see. Which leads into the point you make about the challenges of stigma. So, for all that we have a responsibility to do within the Government, within the health service, within local authorities, much of what we discuss is about our part to play as members of society and the country we live in, and that's why we aim to be a dementia-friendly nation. It's about how we behave with and towards other people, not just those that we know, but in particular, how we behave towards those people that we don't know, and that point about a greater level of tolerance and understanding that would not just make a difference here in the field of dementia, but more generally. I'm thinking of the way that we're prepared to treat other people, and expect to be treated ourselves.
That's why I'm particularly pleased to see such a large number of people, over just one year, who have got engaged and become dementia friends—38,000 extra people in one year, now 158,000 dementia friends across Wales. That's a really positive step forward. And I can say that from my own point of view, my constituency office and I, we are dementia friends—I am a dementia friend—having undertaken the training. Because I recognise it wasn't just about the job I do in this place, but actually, as a constituency Member, we already work with people living with dementia, and we will be contacted by people living with dementia now and in the future as well. It's a big part of our constituency already, and for other constituency and regional Members here too. And I know that Jayne Bryant and others are looking to encourage people so that this place could become the first dementia-friendly Parliament as well, if every Member has undertaken that training, together with their staff, and I'd encourage people to do so.
And on your broader points about how that helps, actually, we're seeing more and more people getting involved across the retail sector, for example, not just the support in terms of the charitable funds that people are providing, but actually, again, encouraging their staff to become dementia friends. And Boots is a good example; other community pharmacy and multiples are available. But in this particular one, it was the Wales part of that company that led the charge within that company, by having, in every single Boots outlet, dementia friends. There was a large programme of activity and engagement, and I was very proud to recognise that when they came here, and they're actually challenging the rest of the Boots group within the UK to do likewise. So, again, a movement that is gathering pace here in Wales, with that initiative, is going to make a difference here and beyond.
I just want to finish on your point about personal experience that many Members in this place will have. We recognise that a change is required. And not just because we can often talk about our own experiences, but the needs of our population are changing. It's not just about age—there is more than that—but actually our ageing profile means it will be a larger reality of the country that we are and will be in the future. And if we didn't recognise that a change was required to deliver the dignity and compassion that you talk about, then we wouldn't have a plan, we wouldn't have measures, and we wouldn't be taken so seriously as we are. The challenge will be to meet the ambition we've set in the plan, to make a real, practical difference.

Lynne Neagle AC: Thank you for your statement, Minister. It's good to have an update today, and I welcome much of the positive report that there is in your statement, particularly about the increase in the number of dementia friends. I've got a few specific questions on the action plan. I was grateful for your replies to myself as Chair of the cross-party group on dementia around the transparency of funding for the plan, which is largely going out through the integrated care fund, and concerns about that have also been raised in the health committee. I was pleased to receive your answer and the assurances that you gave. But can I ask whether there are any plans for there to be any kind of independent evaluation of the impact of the plan, in recognition of some of the concerns that have continued to be expressed about transparency?
Linked to that, you've mentioned the work of the DOIIG, but I know that some third sector organisations are very keen to have a different leadership structure, one that involves somebody particularly championing this cause at Government level. Have you given any consideration to how this work is going to be driven forward by particular leaders within Welsh Government? You mentioned in your statement the input of those living with dementia, and that is a very positive feature of the work of Welsh Government in this area. And, in particular, I'd like to recognise the ongoing impact of DEEP in this area. But there was a phenomenal amount of involvement by those living with dementia in the formation of the plan. So, can I ask you for further detail? There was some 1,000 people who inputted into the action plan, so can I ask for some further detail on how you will continue to ensure that those living with dementia will be fully involved going forward?
And, just finally, I was pleased to see the reference to the Welsh Language Commissioner and Alzheimer's Society Cymru report in your statement. It is a really important report, and one that I was really pleased to attend the launch of. I don't think that we can overestimate the importance of the ability to communicate in your first language for someone with dementia, given the huge challenges of communication that exist. I'm pleased that Welsh Government are going to be involved in the group that the commissioner and the society have set up, but can you take this opportunity to restate your commitment politically to ensuring that the excellent recommendations in that report are driven forward?

Vaughan Gething AC: Yes, I'm happy to give the commitment that you asked for at the end about making sure that we do continue to take forward the commitments that have been made, and in particular the point about first language provision, because as I said in answer to Dai Lloyd, this is not a preference, it's a care need, because actually you can't access the care that you need if you don't have the ability to communicate in what sometimes is the only language available to you. So, I'm more than happy to restate that commitment.
On your point about DEEP, they were definitely involved and a really important part of us getting to having a dementia action plan in the first place, and actually getting one signed off where there was an agreement that it was the right thing to do to move forward. We listened about making sure that there were people involved on the oversight, implementation and impact group. And it's important that we don't just say that means everything is sorted. People living with dementia are represented by a handful of people in one group. That comes back to the point about generally having teams around the individuals so that our services are genuinely responding to the needs of people and proactively seeking the views of those people as we develop and deliver services. That is central to our ambitions in the plan.
And that's partly why—and I'll come back to your first point now about evaluations, to understand is that really is happening. So, yes, I can confirm there will be independent evaluation, it will be commencing throughout this year and it will continue until the end of the plan. There will be an initial assessment of evidence and data availability to highlight any key gaps we may have and a final draft report on central elements will be delivered by the end of 2021, with a final evaluation report that is currently due to be provided in Spring 2022. So, we are definitely making sure that the independent evaluation understands the impact of the steps that we're taking.
On your second point that you made about leadership within and outside the Government, I have an open mind about whether there should be an identified dementia champion or not. Because actually this is a big service challenge that is in more than one area. I recognise the argument about having a champion and I recognise how actually that may not deliver all we'd want to do. So, I have a genuine open mind. I don't think it would be fair to say that the allied health professionals consultant is effectively going to be the champion. They'll have a role, obviously, in championing the needs of the service and understanding and listening to people, but I do have an open mind about whether an identified champion or champions could help us to make more progress. That will come from listening to people and services on that oversight and impact group as to whether that would be the right thing to do to help drive forward this agenda. So, an open mind—certainly not closed to it—but I'm interested genuinely in what will make the biggest difference in the most rapid period of time.

Vikki Howells AC: Thank you, Minister, for your statement here today. As the number of people living with dementia in Wales increases, it's so important that we get this provision right. I notice firstly in your statement the reference to the increased number of dementia friends and dementia friendly communities. My office, along with the offices of many other Assembly Members, have undergone that training and I think it's really important in terms of the support that we offer to our communities. What can be done to encourage other such community support services to engage with the training that the Alzheimer's Society offers?
For my other questions, I want to focus on some interesting things that I have seen out and about on constituency visits. Firstly, I recently met with the occupational therapy team at Ysbyty Cwm Cynon to discuss their work supporting people who have recently been diagnosed with dementia and how they enable them to regain their confidence and to live independently. I joined one of those OTs on a house visit in Penywaun, and had such really positive feedback from the person being helped about how the intervention had really changed his life. So, what can be done to ensure that other areas, both within Cwm Taf and further afield, learn from this kind of approach?
I also recently visited the award-winning virtual ward at St John's medical practice in Aberdare, which is a shining example of a multidisciplinary approach. And this kind of approach is so useful to supporting those living with dementia, as well as many other conditions. So, what can the Welsh Government do to help enable and incentivise such partnership working in GP clusters to assist those living with dementia to receive the very best multidisciplinary care?
And finally, I also visited Ysguborwen Care Home in Llwydcoed to see a fantastic project that was being delivered by the Wales Co-operative Centre, which allowed residents to utilise modern technology, such as iPads, screens and interactive tables, in order to engage with hobbies that they'd held all their lives or to look at old photographs that really re-jigged those deep parts of the memory and brought such happiness to them. What more can Welsh Government do to encourage care homes to utilise the very powerful benefits of modern technology in order to help those who live with dementia to maintain those pre-existing hobbies and interests that can add so much to their quality of life?

Vaughan Gething AC: Thank you for the questions and comments. I think, turning to your point about GP clusters first, I think that, when we consider the action that's been taken through the regional partnership boards that we're looking to promote, lots of that activity is taking place within primary care. So, having more GP-led memory clinics and the focus on diagnosis needs to be accompanied by an improvement in the quality of care that is then provided, rather than simply improving the diagnosis rate and then not providing the service wrapped around that person and how they live their life. So there's an awful lot of focus on that. And this is standard business for our health service. It's not an additional add-on or a niche area of specialist activity. The numbers of people living with dementia will only increase in years to come, so better management of the condition and better identification is central to that, and without an active GP community, we're unlikely to realise a number of the ambitions within the plan.
I'm really pleased to hear that you and your office are dementia friends, and that's part of the awareness raising, the leadership and people recognising and saying out loud, 'I'm a dementia friend, I think you should be too.' And asking that question as we go about our business is part of doing so. But, to get from where we were, where we had 120,000 dementia friends in Wales, and then in the last year to get to 158,000 does show there is a developing and increasing level of awareness. And, as I said, I think that we all have an individual stake in needing to do that, and I think it'd be a really proud moment for Wales if we were able to be the first dementia-friendly parliament within the UK and beyond.
On your point about technology and activity, and lots of it is what I've seen within care homes and beyond, technology is being used really positively to help people exactly as you say, with hobbies and activities. There's lots of activity around music, but actually just on storing and reminding people of memories and the understanding of how we can make it easier for people to access those memories are things that actually continue to bring great joy to people's lives, not just the person themselves, but actually their family and friends around them as well. So, I'm interested not in just seeing the whole range of different activities but actually how we can try and understand which ones we think can help to make the biggest difference and, at the same time, how we can make sure that who that person is is reflected in those memories, rather than saying you're only allowed to have a photo book or to go and sing, because for lots of people like me—I love singing. Others may not like listening to it, but I love singing. And on a recent visit to west Wales, I looked again at how they had a range of singing activities for individuals that was making a big difference to people, but there are others who may not find that appealing at all, so we've got to think again about what matters to that person.
And I want to end on your point about the occupational therapy team in Ysbyty Cwm Cynon. I, too, had the pleasure of visiting them to meet the team and some of the people who are living with dementia who came into Ysbyty Cwm Cynon for the afternoon to explain how their work had made a difference to them. And there's a point there about the earlier we understand someone's needs, the earlier we can intervene and support them to retain more of what matters and is important to them. There is learning to be taken from across Cwm Taf Morgannwg, a real example of good practice that others should learn from across the service. And I'm happy to say that they've built in evaluation and research into the work that they're doing. So they won't just be able to say, 'We think we're doing the right thing', they'll have an evidence base to talk to the rest of the health board and, indeed, the rest of the NHS and wider family on how to make a real difference for people living with dementia.

Joyce Watson AC: Thank you.

4. Statement by the Deputy Minister for Housing and Local Government: The Wales Coast Path

Joyce Watson AC: We move on now to item 4, a statement by the Deputy Minister for Housing and Local Government on the Wales coast path. I call on the Deputy Minister for Housing and Local Government, Hannah Blythyn, to open.

Hannah Blythyn AC: Thank you, acting Deputy Presiding Officer.
Last week, we celebrated the twentieth anniversary of devolution in Wales, an occasion that provided an opportunity to reflect on our key achievements in the past two decades. Since its opening in 2012, the Wales coast path has established itself as a beacon of our nation's natural beauty. Its route stretches 870 miles around our entire coastline and is the first of its kind in the world, an achievement that we can all be proud of.
So, as we look back on the achievements of devolution, I wanted to highlight how we are continuing to develop and promote this fantastic asset, as well as how this fits in with wider efforts to increase access to our great outdoors. The path is a jewel in Wales's tourism offer. It makes a huge contribution to the Welsh economy, and it is estimated that it generates around £84 million a year in visitor spending and supports more than 1,000 jobs. The offer though is not simply about tourism and the economy; our Wales coast path can bring broader health and well-being benefits. We must make sure the benefits of the path are valued and enjoyed by people and communities across the country, in particular everyone who lives and works near our coast.
However, a hugely popular walking route can also bring with it issues and challenges, and we are continuing to invest in upkeep and maintenance. Our partnership with Natural Resources Wales sees nearly £1 million invested annually. NRW, who look after the path on our behalf, continue to work with local authorities and landowners to improve the alignment and quality of the path, and mitigate erosion.
A series of new circular routes, new publicity material and a toolkit for coastal businesses are some of our latest initiatives. The toolkit has been designed to help coastal businesses market their products and services through the pulling power of the path. It is a free, easy-to-use online resource that gives businesses access to a wide range of material and information in one place. It provides guidance on how businesses can give customers an unforgettable experience and better market their own businesses, using the coast path as a key asset. The toolkit was launched in March this year, with a series of free seminars around our coast, from Swansea to Narberth, and Conwy to Beaumaris.
A revamped website is in development. It will provide up-to-date information and a new interactive mapping tool. Natural Resources Wales is also working on a new augmented reality app, which will include engaging visuals, informative stories and interactive games.
Some of our more intrepid walkers complete the whole path in one go or over a period as part of a challenge. For those people, we are looking at a new system to incentivise and reward people completing stages or the whole trail. Far more people, however, walk shorter sections. With this in mind, we are developing different ways for people to enjoy their visit. A new series of circular routes will open up more of our fantastic inland countryside, in addition to the coast itself.
This year is the Year of Discovery in Wales, and this May marks seven years since the path was officially launched. Our coast path is celebrating by holding its very own walking festival, and I'd like to pay tribute to Ramblers Cymru for putting on a huge range of events, catering for all abilities. 
As well as the coast path, we have three national trails and a range of other promoted local routes to enjoy. These provide access to some of our country’s finest scenery, not only for walkers but also for cyclists and horse riders. I was therefore pleased that we were able to fund additional projects worth over £0.5 million to improve the coast path and national trails in 2018-19. These will allow some important pieces of work to be carried out to improve the experience for everyone.
This Welsh Government is committed to deriving greater benefit from the huge network of footpaths we have. Wales has the greatest length of rights of way per square kilometrein the UK. However, improvements can be made to the way access to the outdoors is provided, managed and promoted in Wales. We've consulted very widely on a range of measures, and I'm grateful for the input of thousands of people and organisations. The size of the response we received is testament to the huge value the people of Wales place on their cherished countryside and landscapes. I made a written statement last month, responding to this consultation, that sets out our planned way forward.
Our long-term approach to access will be to provide a greater range of opportunities for outdoor activities. It will also promote responsible recreation that strikes an appropriate balance between the interests of both users and landowners. Our countryside is hugely important to the people of Wales and everyone must continue to have the opportunity to enjoy it. The success of the Wales coast path, and our commitment to reforming access more broadly, will ensure we continue to build on this success for the benefit of all the people of Wales.

The Llywydd took the Chair.

David Melding AC: Can I thank the Deputy Minister for this very timely statement, made during the remarkable Wales Coast Path Walking Festival? Can I pay tribute too to the hard work of Ramblers Cymru, who are facilitating many of the festivities? Can I also emphasise to the Minister and the Chamber that I am a keen user of the path, especially in Pembrokeshire, Ceredigion and on my home patch, Glamorgan? So, I benefit immensely from this wonderful facility.
I'm particularly pleased to see the development of the app and the revamped website. I do believe in making this vital tourist attraction more accessible in a modern digital age. It sends a good image, I think, of Wales. As the Minister said, the coastal path is the world's first uninterrupted route along a national coast and gives hikers access to undiscovered sections of the coast, with stunning views, as I can attest to, and also rugged landscapes and rare wildlife. It's very pleasing indeed, actually, to take a pair of binoculars along with you and then just see some of the most wonderful but usually secluded wildlife. It truly is something to be proud of.
I'm also pleased to see how the Government is encouraging innovations, such as the development of circular routes that are connected to the path. I know from experience that, sometimes, if you've just got a day, you're looking for a circular route. It's really, really useful to have that, and it also brings a slightly wider area into connection with the path.
There are some issues, and I make these just to improve what is, I think, a great facility. The Minister referred to access issues, and we do know that some local disability fora have highlighted the issues around access by wheelchair and other barriers, such as those that are sometimes put in to stop motorbike riders from illegally getting onto the path. I know that at least one county council, Flintshire, has admitted that it does need to improve its access for disabled users, particularly where it's connected to viewing points, for instance. It's a great thing to enjoy, and I think we must remember that those with limited mobility or who are wheelchair-dependent still want to enjoy as much as possible the open environment. So, I think that's something to bear in mind.
If I can turn to marketing, the marketing toolkit, which I have looked at, is very comprehensive, covering all aspects of a marketing operation for local businesses, which can then capitalise on the walking paths. This, I think, is really, really important, but I just wonder if you're going to take it further and connect it to a properly funded strategy for walking in Wales. I know this is something that Ramblers Cymru are really keen to see, and we should set ambitious targets to promote walking as an everyday activity with additional support for the least active.
As you said in your statement, the benefits of the coastal path are not solely felt through the economy and tourism, though they are principally felt there, as the figures you referred to demonstrate, but there are health and well-being benefits too, and we can also connect it to our legislative basis in the Active Travel (Wales) Act 2013. Ramblers Cymru have also mentioned the need to connect it into the health service, so that we can get people more active there who have or are developing the likelihood of health problems.
I also think there needs to be an international strategy. Llywydd, you can now walk all around Wales. I have walked the entire length of Offa's Dyke though it's—I'm amazed to think this, but it is 40 years since I did that, between sixth-form and university. But Wales is already pretty well-known out there internationally, and I think we need to build on that, because it's a premier location for walkers. It's particularly popular with walkers who come from the Netherlands and from Germany, but also other parts of Europe and also North America and other parts of the world. What these people want when they're enjoying our wonderful environment, both, as I said, up into the mountains but also around the coast, is they want boutique hotels, they want really good-quality restaurants—

Member of the Senedd: Hear, hear.

David Melding AC: —and they want access to—indeed, I hear another Member, who I know has enjoyed these facilities—nearby market towns and villages, so, you know, with good transport links when you need to make that little journey from the walking path you're following. But these people spend a lot of money. They're high-end tourists. When we think of people who are walking, we could be tempted to think it's a holiday that doesn't bring in much economic activity for the local community. Well, that's quite wrong. These people really are leading in terms of developing our tourism and improving the facilities, so that we're really up there getting some of those active tourists and cultural tourists also, who want to experience the totality of Wales but also enjoy very good restaurants and hotels when they do that—. But, broadly, this is work that's really been well developed, we warmly welcome it, and I do hope the Government will act on some of the suggestions I've made, which I know they've reflected on and the consultation has also, and other organisations like the Ramblers are making these points. Thank you.

Hannah Blythyn AC: Diolch. The Member will be pleased to see, with the use of the new app and the developed website, the modern technology being used to boost our natural assets and to promote them. I think the Member did a very good job there himself of very eloquently promoting our wonderful Wales coast path. The Member mentions about being a regular user. I would suspect and hope that all of us in this Chamber use the coastal path to some extent or another, and I actually look forward myself to joining Ramblers Cymru on one of their anniversary walks at the weekend as well.
I think you raise an issue that's been raised with me before in terms of access, in particular people with disabilities. I think it's about getting that balance between protecting the route but also making sure all the people of Wales can enjoy it in the right and responsible way, and I'm sure that's something, as we take forward the proposals on access, that we can discuss with stakeholders, with disability forums, but also with our partners in local authorities, NRW and landowners alike. The importance of circular routes—I think not everybody wants to walk the entire coastal path or are able to, and also you go to one point and then you don't necessarily feel fit enough or have enough time to walk back again. One of the things we're trying to develop with the new circular routes is actually starting to get this aimed at, perhaps, more family audiences, to bring them on board to start to enjoy the health and well-being benefits of the coastal path, and these are looking at being around 2 miles in length, so you're looking at just about an hour or two, and actually making sure they're near to facilities and transport links as well. So, it's thinking strategically about how we do that in the future.
A really important point too on being a part of an international strategy about how we sell Wales to the world. I was just in my own constituency, out on Friday, and the best kind of meetings and walks I have are when I go for a meeting in the Clwydian range and have a walk, and I was up the Penycloddiau hill fort, and you look out into the distance and in one direction you've got Ruthin and Denbigh, and beyond that you can see the Snowdonia range and Offa's Dyke. This is not only just to promote to more people within Wales what we have on our doorstep and the benefits that brings, but actually internationally the wonderful natural environment we have. And I'm pleased that the Minister for International Relations and the Welsh Language, as part of her new international strategy—that will include the importance of Wales's natural assets and promoting tourism, inward investment and that positive image of Wales as well.

Dai Lloyd AC: May I thank, first of all, the Deputy Minister for her statement, and, of course, I welcome the content of it, because the issue of the Wales coast path is one very much to be welcomed. It was an exciting development and it's a development that we have seen developing further over the last seven years, and we can look forward to seeing it continuing to develop year after year. Because there are magnificent views the length and breadth of Wales, and, of course, along the 876 miles of the coast and along the Wales coast path. And as we heard from the Deputy Minister, this is the only nation that has a coast path that does include its entire coast, and that is something to be treasured and celebrated. Of course, there are a number of magnificent sections to our coast—I won't just focus on the Gower, with 26 magnificent beaches that can be enjoyed, or Llansteffan, or even where I was over the weekend, in Manorbier, where the coast is wonderful there in south Pembrokeshire, before we go on to the Ceredigion coast, of course, which is full of wonders. And Aberaeron is a treasure, I do have to say. But I can't talk all afternoon on this, so I should focus on specific issues with regard to the celebration and the statement, indeed.

Dai Lloyd AC: Yes, it's a matter to be welcomed, of course, but there are two points to make, though: of course, conservation is vitally important, and, of course, as David Melding has mentioned, health issues are also very important, and we also pay tribute to the Ramblers for promoting walking in our nation. It's a fairly easy way to keep fit. You don't need membership of any gym that costs thousands of pounds. Walking is the way forward—10,000 steps every day. And just going on the Wales coast path—you will have achieved that in the blink of an eye, and it wouldn't feel like 10,000 steps either. And this is vitally important when we talk about conservation. This is an element of tourism that attracts tourists, attracts money and boosts the economy, but, thinking about responsible tourism, therefore, that also safeguards the environment, and that whole conservation aspect is vitally important.
And, of course, there's caring for our environment, and also, taking advantage of the opportunity, I'd like to see the Deputy Minister emphasising this: it's not just a case of looking after our natural environment, but also about looking after our linguistic and cultural environment, because, for many parts of it, it is the Welsh language and Welsh culture that are inextricably linked to this coastline. There are some examples where we are losing our old traditional Welsh names, and not just those traditional Welsh names but historic Welsh names, and names in several other languages. We've lost Porth Trecastell on Anglesey, which is now Cable bay, and there are some other examples, just because people can't pronounce the name of the island or the name of the river or the name of a particular headland. But I can't think of any other countries on earth that would be willing to change the names that they've had on various geographical places for centuries in order to please those people who don't want to give the indigenous language a go.
So, just because somewhere looks isolated or remote on our coastline, that doesn't mean that it doesn't have a traditional name—either a Welsh name or a Brythonic name or a Viking-inspired name. So, we need to keep those names, not just in terms of natural conservation but because of the linguistic and cultural conservation of our nation, given the natural wealth of all of our names. Every headland and every part of the coastal map has a name. If you look at the historic maps of our nation and at the wealth of names and the descriptions that are there in the Welsh language—of course, some of the modern maps don't include all of those names, so people will think, 'Well, this place doesn't have a name. Why don't we give another name to it—a name from another nation?' No, it will have a name—it's a matter of finding that original name. So, I'd like to have some sort of assurance from the Deputy Minister that we are considering these matters of safeguarding and conserving natural place names on our coastline as well.
The second point, as well as congratulating everything that is going on with regard to the path that you can walk on around our coastline, some have mentioned the creation of an all-Wales cycling route. Some Ministers in this place are very fond of cycling, so what about developing a cycling route alongside the walking route, because I think that there is a valuable resource there as well?
To conclude, therefore, we'll be tackling the health agenda, the fitness agenda, the obesity agenda, as well as getting to grips with the tourism issue, that considerate tourism, that does not just mean turning up and thinking, 'Well, if it rains, what do we do then?' It's about thinking about the development of our nation and explaining to people the rich history of our nation, and our language and our culture, without being ashamed of it at all, and what is there with our coast path. What is there not to like about the coast path? Long live the Wales coast path. Thank you.

Hannah Blythyn AC: Llywydd, I think, in future, when we want to create marketing adverts for the Wales coast path, we should just ask Members in this Chamber to talk about their favourite areas. I'm sure we all have a favourite and we all have areas we've not been to yet, which we'd really like to go to. But I think the contributions so far show how valued a natural asset it is for all of us, as the only nation, indeed, as Dai Lloyd said, that can boast having a coast path that covers magnificent stretches. I remember many years ago, when I was working outside of Wales, people there would come up to me and talk about the Wales coast path; they were going there on holiday and I'd tell them about different places that they could visit as well. So, it shows the vision and the reach that we have to build on there.
The Member is absolutely right in terms of the work that Ramblers Cymru are doing in promoting walking, for a lot of people as an accessible way to keep fit and to boost their health, and where you can do as little or as much as you want. And it's right that we're looking at these new circular routes and shorter routes so that people can—you know, to make it open to as many people as possible.
On the points the Member made in terms of it not just being about conserving our natural environment—and, as you know, we want more people to enjoy the coast path, but it's absolutely right to strike that balance between conservation and promotion, to make sure we maintain our natural assets, but also there's also the aspect of the environment in terms of, actually, how we deal with things that are very high in public consciousness, such as plastic pollution and littering, so the role that some of the other initiatives we're taking across Government, as part of Refill Cymru, can play in that as well.
In terms of looking at our cultural environment, one of the things we're looking at, building on these new circular routes or different routes, is, actually, to focus on different areas, not in terms of geographical areas, but culture and heritage. As we take that forward, there might be something that the Member would want me to share information with him on and for you to be able to input into that, as we take it forward as well.
In terms of cycling, I confess I am a keen but somewhat lapsed cyclist at the moment, given that it's difficult, often, to find the time. I keep thinking, 'Oh, in the next recess, I'll get out for a long bike ride' and it keeps going back to the next and the one after that. But one of the things, following the written statement on access, that we'll look at is how we can better use multi-use passes for activities like cycling and also horse riding as well.

Joyce Watson AC: I'd like to thank you for your statement today, Deputy Minister. I'm very lucky to live close to some of the most spectacular and celebrated stretches of our country's coastline, one of those being the Pembrokeshire coast. I do represent many more miles, of course, and most of the coastal path is, in fact, in my region, and it stretches from the Llŷn peninsula to Carmarthen bay. There are unique discoveries to be found all along the 870 uninterrupted miles of the Welsh coastline—so I won't be doing a circular walk in a day—from rare wildlife to industrial heritage. And you can see both together, if you know where to look. You will see kestrels, little owls and many other examples of bird life living in what are disused, now, industrial sites, but they're not unused industrial sites if you care to look for those things. So, I think we need to join those two elements together to tell another story that we are able to do.
I think that the Wales Coast Path Walking Festival, ending this week, has been brilliant in celebrating and promoting the coastal path. I think it's also worth reminding ourselves that the Wales coastal path is just seven years old. So, we have moved along pretty quickly within those seven years. And we know that visitors have always headed to our coast for different reasons, whether it was the miners' fortnight at Barry Island, or whether it was dolphin watching in Cardigan bay. But we've created the unbroken path; it's a continuous physical link. The Wales coast path project can, going forward, create more opportunities to link together those different visitor experiences and therefore boost tourism in the years to come. I have to agree with David Melding when he talks about this being high-end tourism, because people who walk the path do it for many different reasons—bird-watching is one reason, photography will be another reason—and there will be sales of cameras and binoculars, backpacks and other things along the way, and those people who sell those goods really do gain from this creation.
So, I hope that you'll continue to support and promote initiatives like the walking festival, which do help to sell the Welsh coast as a destination for more reasons and all seasons, and I think that that's a key message, because people do walk this path in all seasons and for many different reasons. One of the questions that I would like, Deputy Minister, is whether you will join me in thanking the people who keep that path open, from the staff who work—and I've met some of them; I'm sure others have—in all sorts of weathers to the volunteers who also take up opportunities to make sure that we can keep walking this path, and also to recognise—and other people have mentioned it today—the real benefits to people, particularly mental health benefits, from either volunteering in working opportunities to keep that path in good order, or to escape to the countryside just to make them feel good and so that they can escape the pressures of work. I think that that is of critical importance, which is now, I'm glad to say, eventually being recognised.

Hannah Blythyn AC: I absolutely join Joyce Watson in thanking the staff and volunteers who keep this wonderful asset of our path open, maintained, sustained, like you said, in all weathers throughout the year. Their work and their commitment are certainly to be applauded, and you're very lucky to represent the area you do and boast such a huge swathe of the coast path itself amongst that.
You talked about, actually, how one of the wonderful things, one of the amazing things about the coast path is it can combine rare wildlife with our rich industrial heritage as well, and, actually, how we bring them both together and promote that to visitors to the coast path. I can see that in my own area alone, where we've now got a new section put in the trail with the old pithead and the Point of Ayr colliery and a model of the old pit pony, and it gives you some boards there with the history of it, but you go just around the corner and then there's the RSPB area where you can look out across the Dee estuary.
So, yes, certainly, it's what we have worked on and we should build on, and one of the things we're looking at—I know the Member said she was going to do the long walks, not the circular walks, but one of the things we are looking at, as I said earlier, in terms of these circuits, is looking at focuses and different themes, and one of them could be wildness and certainly heritage as well, so that's one way we can maximise on those assets as we take this work forward.
In terms of high-end tourism and the opportunities there for us both as a nation, but also those businesses involved, that's why I think the toolkit for coastal businesses is very, very important and to do what we can as Members, too, to promote that to businesses within our own constituencies and our own regions. There's a range of material that these businesses can benefit from. Resources include logos they can use, news items—they can get posters and videos to use on their own online/offline marketing to try and capture that growing market as well. I definitely will be promoting the walking festival. I will be there on Sunday, and I will manage to find a walk that combines two elements of my portfolio, where I'll be going for a walk and also litter picking as well.

Huw Irranca-Davies AC: When I grew up, I was born in Gowerton, and if you turned left going out of my house—the steelworks were right in front, but, if you turned left, you'd walk down the old—submerged now—canal path, where once a famous Conservative son of Swansea was lifted bodily out of a Labour Party meeting and hurled into the canal. It's now been filled in, so that can't happen anymore. But you follow the canal along there and it takes you down to Penclawdd and the mudflats of the north Gower, the estuary, the Loughor estuary, and, if you keep on going around the 13-mile peninsula, you then turn into the beautiful sandy coves on the south. I thought I'd been born in heaven, I have to say. I thought I was extremely lucky. But, as you get older, you start to realise that, actually, we're blessed in Wales, throughout Wales. All parts of the coast are remarkable, are glorious.

Huw Irranca-Davies AC: My only regret in celebrating, as I did, last weekend with Ramblers Cymru, Pembrokeshire national park, Natural Resources Wales, a local ramblers group, my old colleague Andrew Campbell of the Wales Tourism Alliance—. We were gathered there in Saundersfoot doing a mix of coastal path and heritage trails, going inland a little bit—some of the new circular routes. My only regret is that Wales beat England to the march on this, but it's a nice regret, actually. I took through the coastal path Bill for England back in—. Crikey, when was that? A decade or more ago. And we're still building it. Now, it's a big thing, but we'll get there, apparently, by 2021. But that will then be remarkable, that you'd be able to walk not only the Wales coastal path but all of the England coastal path as well, from Carlisle to Newcastle and beyond, and walk the whole of England and Wales, should you have the time and be so inclined and have stout boots and make that whole journey. But I guess I am one, Llywydd, of those people referred to as those people who do go and spend money in the local economy. I will walk for miles and miles and miles but then always end up spending on a good meal and a few beers, and probably a nice place to stay in a B&B overnight. And there's plenty of people who do that. It's remarkable—the impact on the economy. And we shouldn't forget, of course, and I welcome the statement today, that this is in the fine tradition of things like the Countryside and Rights of Way Act 2000, the rights to roam, the access to the national parks, the rights of way legislation—all of those things that have opened up the countryside and coast for generations of people since that first progressive post-war Government, and long may this continue. Interestingly, while we were in Saundersfoot, we saw the development there of the new marine centre—the scaffolding was going up and so on—and the magnificent harbour development that they have there, with £4 million of possibly our last tranche of European funding going into it, into a remarkable performance and gathering space on that harbour, transforming it for a new generation.
If I could ask a couple of questions of the Minister—. It's been referred to already, the issue of accessibility of sections, at least, of the coastal path, for those with mobility issues or those who use wheelchairs or mobility devices. It's right that we make sure that the coastal path is accessible for everyone. Also, what do we do for diverse groups that don't normally access the outdoors? I recall we had a very good mosaic project, working with the national parks years ago, that was looking at different communities from BAME communities who, traditionally, generationally, do not go out into the outdoors, but working with them and with people within those communities to introduce those communities—and multigenerational within those communities; mums and dads and grandads as well as the children—to the outdoors. What are we doing on that to make the most of that with our Wales coastal path?
I wonder if the Minister could also speak to her colleague dealing with transport and public transport, to have a look—I don't need the answer now, but to have a look at the TrawsCymru buses issue, because a lot of people I know have made really good use of the free weekend TrawsCymru transport in order to go. I'm looking forward to my free bus pass when I get older, okay—is it 60 or 65? I'll have to check. Not long to go. But the number of people I speak to who are walking sections of the coastal path using either the free bus pass or the TrawsCymru weekend bus and then walking sections back and then catching it again—it's really opened it up. In terms of social inclusion and healthy lifestyles and so on, it's a major innovation. So, if that discussion could happen—.
Could I, certainly as vice president—one of the two vice presidents—of Ramblers Cymru, give my great thanks to the Ramblers—not just for what they're doing with the festival at the moment, but their ongoing work with maintaining footpaths, byways and so on? It is always a challenge—there's a lot of volunteer effort in it—but they really deserve credit for what they do.
Perhaps I could ask the Minister as well for her thoughts on the continuing challenges, because of where we are with funding, tight funding, at the moment. I'm going to try and avoid using the 'austerity' word—. No, it's out there now. But local authorities arestretched in terms of their rights of way. People now connecting up some of the circular routes, on the coastal strip as well, is to do with keeping those normal rights of way accessible as well.
And, finally, if I could simply say how much I welcome this, because of the innovations in here, not least the toolkits for businesses, as well as the circular routes, which should meet everybody’s possible needs—. Long may it continue. Keep the energy behind this. Don’t give up on it. And it’d be interesting to see, maybe in a couple of years, a further economic assessment of the impact of the coastal path on the Welsh economy.

Hannah Blythyn AC: Llywydd, I’m afraid I’m going to have to start by saying that I fundamentally disagree with the Member: I don’t at all regret that Wales beat England to the mark on this. But I absolutely agree with Huw andthank Ramblers Cymru, not just for the walking festival that ends this weekend, but also for the ongoing role they play in terms of not just the maintenance and looking after our coast path, but also the initiatives they bring forward to encourage people to benefit from it as well. And, on that, I think everybody could—. On the accessibility issues, I think there is, like you said, that balance between making sure we don’t have vehicles that aren’t meant to be there, but actually making sure that as many people as possible, across Wales and beyond, can make the most of what’s there on many of our doorsteps. So, like I said, it’s certainly something that should be considered with stakeholders and local authority partners and NRW as we take forward some of the access reforms.
One of the great benefits of this portfolio and my previous one is that I get to have what are called meetings, when I get out and about in the fresh air, and I get to enjoy this to see what’s happening in practice and, talking about actually how we introduce communities who don’t usually use the outdoors, as part of that, I’ve seen a number of really good examples of best practice across the length and breadth of the coast, but also inland, in our national parks as well. So, it's certainly something that I want to see replicated in communities elsewhere. Perhaps this focus on some of the new, shorter walks and circular routes that are more accessible by public transport and facilities might be a means to encourage more people to literally take that first step and to enjoy our Wales coast path. I’m certainly more than happy to have a conversation with my colleague the Minister for Economy and Transport with regard to actually how we, in terms of TrawsCymru, make sure that, you know, all modes of transport, our feet and our public transport, can match up to best promote our coast path in the future.

I thank the Deputy Minister.

5. Statement by the Deputy Minister for Economy and Transport: Active Travel

The next item, therefore, is the statement by the Deputy Minister for Economy and Transport on active travel. And I call on the Deputy Minister to make the statement—Lee Waters.

Lee Waters AC: Diolch, Llywydd.We have a climate emergency, an obesity epidemic and an air quality crisis. Getting more people travelling in ways that improve their health and our environment is key to tackling all those problems. Transport accounts for 13 per cent of Wales’s climate changing emissions, and almost all of them come from the private car. Our recently published low-carbon delivery plan put achieving modal shift at its centre, and by that we mean making it easier for people to make fewer journeys by car, by making it easier to use alternatives. Over half of all car journeys are for distances of under five miles. Many of these trips could be made by walking and cycling. That is why encouraging active travel is a priority for this Government. The key is understanding what needs to change to open up this option to more people.
Despite having world-leading legislation in the form of the Active Travel (Wales) Act 2013 and the well-being of future generations Act, we have not seen anything like the increase in walking and cycling levels that we want and need. We have rehearsed the reasons for that underperformance many times in this Chamber. Resources are key, and I am pleased to say that this year, for the first time ever, we'll be spending over £30 million on active travel schemes in Wales in one year.
But resources aren’t our only problem. The Economy, Infrastructure and Skills Committee report on the implementation of the Act made that very clear. We have a major issue with capacity and our approach to delivery. We often talk about austerity in this Chamber, but sometimes we don’t pay enough attention to the way it has hollowed out the capacity of our local authorities to deliver on anything other than essential statutory services. Active travel is an area where understaffing is felt particularly severely. As well as capacity, there are also issues about capability to deliver what is, after all, a change in behaviour and culture.

Joyce Watson took the Chair.

Lee Waters AC: We have developed highly regarded guidance on how to design infrastructure that will make walking and cycling a more attractive option, but we need to do more to train and upskill professionals in its use. So I can today announce, Llywydd, that we will be setting aside some of the £30 million to invest in improving skill levels and spreading good practice.
I have met with most of the councillors and front-line officials who we are working with to deliver this project and listened to their concerns. A key one is that good active travel schemes can be complex and annual funding rounds make it difficult to deliver them. So I will be making a total of £6.3 million available to local authorities on a pro-rata basis to allow them to design and plan schemes in advance of submitting full funding bids.
Resources will always be scarce and we must ensure that we invest in a way that maximises outcomes. We can’t afford to spread the jam so thinly that communities get a bit of path but not enough to get them anywhere. We have to concentrate our resources on building routes that will allow people to make whole journeys to places they need to get to, in safety and comfort from their home to work, or school to the shops. Only then will we be able to convince significant numbers of people to change their travel habits. I am prepared to take flak for building fewer miles of route in fewer places if the routes we do build enable many more people to become active travellers.
We must reward ambition, but also, crucially, help those authorities who have not been ambitious enough to become more ambitious. We will shortly be starting a new round of consultations on local authorities’ plans for their active travel networks, the integrated network maps. I don't want to see random lines on a map that may score high on deliverability but do not create seamless networks that link people up with the places that they want to go. So, I am setting aside money to fund a much more engaging approach to consultation so that the next iteration of the integrated maps that councils submit are based on the views of our target group—those who do not currently walk and cycle—and result in a pipeline of projects that will make a real impact.
Of course, it’s not just about new routes. I want local authorities to use some of their new resources to identify those small changes in roads and paths that can make a big difference. Perhaps widening a popular path or removing poorly designed access barriers that prevent disabled people, parents with prams, parents with children on buggies on the back of their bikes, from being able to get through. Anything that can demonstrate the advantages of people shifting their mode of transport. Local authorities are therefore encouraged to use part of their allocation to fund small projects that deliver continuous improvements to their local networks.
In February, the whole Assembly backed a motion calling for more ambitious active travel targets. I'll deliver on that promise, but for those targets to be meaningful and impactful we must have effective monitoring schemes in place. We are currently funding routes that do not have automatic counters installed in them as a matter of course, for example, and we need to look at that. So I am working with local authorities to develop a much more systematic approach than exists at the moment.
I have outlined the challenges I think we are facing, and they are many. However, I don’t think we should be pessimistic. We are starting to make some of the more difficult decisions that can radically change this agenda. The First Minister announced last week that Wales will begin work to make 20mph the default speed limit in residential areas, which is a real game changer. Lower speeds will not only reduce casualties and improve public health; they will also create an environment that is more friendly to active travel. We have begun work on a new Wales transport strategy, which will be central to realising this ambitious agenda and ensuring that active travel becomes a vital part of major infrastructure projects such as the metro. My colleague Ken Skates and I will keep Members updated on this work.
There is no sweep of the ministerial pen, or single initiative, that can bring about the changes we need to see to reverse the transport trends we’ve seen develop over the last 50 years. It will take ongoing, granular efforts, focused on hundreds of different details, to create an active travel culture. But if we want to improve air quality, increase levels of physical activity and lessen the harmful impacts of transport on our environment, we must dedicate ourselves to it.
And Ifinish with a sincere invitation to Members that I want to hear from you what more you think we should be doing together in your particular communities to allow us to be at the forefront of the active travel movement. Diolch.

Russell George AC: Can I thank the Minister for his statement and announcement this afternoon? I think it's right that the Welsh Government has brought forward world-leading legislation in regard to the active travel Act, but, of course, legislation by itself is not enough—there needs to be action as well, and we haven't seen that action. There's been significant underperformance—we've not seen the level of walking and cycling that we need to see, in terms of what the ambition of the Act was meant to do back in 2013. The Deputy Minister also pointed out in his opening comments that we've rehearsed these arguments in the Chamber before, so I'm not going to dwell on those. But I would like to welcome the very honest statement that's been brought forward today. I very much appreciate the tone of the Deputy Minister's statement—it's a reality check of where we are, and I thank him for his honesty in the assessment of where we're at.
I'm very pleased that the committee's work has seemed to have significantly influenced the Government's thinking as well, in terms of changes in policies that you've detailed in your statement today. You've talked about training for local authorities, integrated network maps, making those small changes that are needed to make a difference. And as you were reading your statement, it was almost as if you were reading the recommendations of the economy committee's report last year. So, that's very welcome, indeed.
In terms of the £30 million for active travel, I think I'm right in saying that when you were in committee last week you talked about the figure being allocated increasing from what was earmarked by a third. I'm just checking for some clarity around that. But, specifically, if I can ask, what is the size of the increase of funding against what was originally planned for this year, and how does this compare to last year's funding levels?
Also, in the economy committee's report, one of the recommendations that we made, of course, was that funding reaches £19 to £20 per head per year of capital and revenue funding. And I would just be grateful if you could confirm whether the funding that you've announce today reaches that limit, and whether you think that the recommendations from the committee and the money that you've allocated today is sufficient to achieve the Welsh Government's ambitions in regard to active travel on what you've announced today.
You were, of course, a member of the committee, Deputy Minister, when this report was being drafted and recommendations were being considered, so you're very aware of the recommendations in the committee's report, and I wonder how have you sought to prioritise the allocation of funding to address the committee report's recommendations. I don't need to go through them—you know what they are already.
And also during general scrutiny last week—and, again, you've mentioned this in your statement today—you talked about the Wales transport strategy, which will be published next year. How do you foresee active travel will feature in this updated strategy, and are you able to indicate when a draft strategy will be available for scrutiny?
And finally, you've asked local authorities for active travel data to identify gaps in active travel information. Are you able to provide more detail on how the monitoring and evaluation framework will be used in practice, particularly how it might improve value for money of investment and also lead to increased active travel rates? I'd be grateful if you could address those points. But I'm very pleased and delighted with the statement and the announcement today.

Lee Waters AC: Thank you very much for those comments. I don't think it's fair to say that we haven't seen action in recent years. I think we have seen action and we've seen a significant amount of money for a number of years from successive Welsh Governments in this agenda. But I think, as the evidence to the committee demonstrated, it's making sure the underpinnings are correct, so that the money is going to be well spent to most effect. I think that's what I hope today's statement is going to address—getting that right.
Because I'm not going to be making a case to the finance Minister or the Minister for the economy alongside me to pour money into a sieve of poorly designed schemes. Because the trouble with a poorly designed path is it discredits the whole agenda. If councils are building paths—for example, next to a road—that are badly designed, the disruption is going to alienate people as it's built, and when they see nobody on these paths, they're simply going to say, 'Well, what was the point of that? What a waste of money. What's this active travel all about?'
I've seen that happen time and again, which is why it's essential that it's no good just having the guidance; we have to train the depleted ranks of local authorities to use it properly and also work with them to collaborate, so there is genuine regional working in this area. That's one of the things that the Minister and I will be considering as he takes forward the recommendations of the White Paper: as we create regional bodies, do we put active travel as part of their core functions? Because clearly there are enormous benefits to the economies of scale.
And what is the role for Transport for Wales in this as well? So, to address his final point on monitoring evaluation, we have had discussions already. I met yesterday with the head of Transport for Wales to discuss this—as they start to build up their own intelligence and data analysis unit, how they can make sure that capturing active travel data is a key part of what they do, and capture the useful data we want to enable us to make better decisions.
In terms of the quantum of funding, we are some way off the £30 a head. I think today's announcement takes us to somewhere around £10 million a head for this year—£10 per head, sorry, this year; £10 million a head would be quite a stretch, wouldn't it—£10 a head this year. But as I say, I want us to make sure we get it right, so next time around we have integrated network maps that create routes based on demand of people who want to walk and cycle. If we can start to engage the community and enthuse them for where routes should be, then I think we can create a head of steam that will allow the political space for us to say, 'We want to spend more on this agenda', and I can credibly go to ministerial colleagues and say, 'Money should be spent on this and not on something else.' I'm not sure, with a good heart, I could do that at the moment, because I'm not confident that that money will be spent to best effect until the issues I've addressed in the statement can be properly worked through.
In terms of the Wales transport strategy, clearly this is going to be an important part of it, but my observations of previous Wales transport strategies is we've been fine on the words around active travel. I often used to notice—some years ago now, 10 years ago or more—we'd have a Wales transport strategy that if you were coming from a different planet and just read the narrative you'd think Wales was an active travel country because the words were all there, but if you looked at the scheme of works at the end, it was all the traditional stuff you saw, there was very little active travel. So, I'm confident that active travel will be a key part of it, as it always has been. What needs to happen next time is that it's a key part of the delivery as well. And that's, if we follow through the things we've announced today, what I think we'll be able to address.

Rhun ap Iorwerth AC: May I welcome this statement from the Government today? Much of it is content that I would agree with. What strikes me and others, of course, is the frustration that we can't reach our endpoint, or where we want to go, more quickly, and I'm sure that that frustration is something that the Deputy Minister himself would share. I do think that the foundations are in place, in a way, in terms of having the Act in place, but we can't ignore the importance of proper funding and providing sufficient resources in order to ensure that the aspirations are delivered in reality.
I welcome the progress made and the fact that we're reaching £30 million. That's an important milestone. I think the figure in Scotland was about £80 million, and that was about two years ago, and that gives us a useful comparator. It's important, then, to look at how much we spend per head. I think that the Institute of Welsh Affairs, in their report last year, said that we need to look at £20 per head in Wales. We have a way to go before we get to that point, of course. Although I do take pride in being ambitious and setting ambitious targets for Government, now that the Minister has mentioned £10 million per head, what I'm asking for doesn't seem sufficient now. But, we do have to keep a close eye on that need and to push those figures up, because we do have a long way to go.
When we are talking about infrastructure, infrastructure is always something that needs proper investment, and we need to invest now in order to ensure that the infrastructure is there for future generations. While I do appreciate the Minister's language in talking about being granular—and Dave Brailsford, as a cycling coach of some repute, has emphasised those incremental improvements that can take us towards those final targets—I think that we are still waiting for that real investment that can make a real difference in putting firmer foundations in place in order to increase active travel for the future.
One other thing that I will comment on is the difference between the aspiration and what is being done on the ground. I welcome the language used by the Minister today in terms of his willingness to help and to work with local authorities to implement the objectives of active travel. I think that, generally speaking, there is a desire at local government level, among officers and elected members, to push this agenda forward, but the leadership, strategy and funding need to come from Government in order to guide people more swiftly along the journey. But, as ever, every step forward is to be welcomed, and we, as an opposition party in this place, will keep an eye on what practical difference is being made and when we can say that, 'Yes, really, five or six years since the passing of this Act, we are taking great steps forward.'

Lee Waters AC: Thank you for the comments. I'm not sure there were any particular questions, but I welcome the tone of what he said. But, just in terms of the final point on the ambition of local authorities, I think we need to be frank that there is unequal ambition. There are a number of local authorities that have demonstrated a woeful lack of ambition, and that partly goes back, I think, to the capacity issue I mentioned, to be fair to them. But I think this is why, in a sense, I want to re-set—and this was the lesson I drew from the evidence that the economy committee took last year. The Act is still in its infancy. This is going to be a long-term change project.
The first maps that came through were a run-through, in effect. The next time, we've got to get it right. I think one of the fundamental problems with the approach we've had to date is that you're asking highway engineers to, in effect, conduct public consultation exercises, which they're not equipped to do, they're not trained to do, and it's not part of their culture. We had some examples of a couple of engineers having a room in a library on a Wednesday afternoon for a couple of hours and being surprised that very few people turned up. But until we get that consultation approach right, we're never going to have the fundamental foundation stone in the right place. So, what I'm looking to do is ring-fencing some of this money and putting out a tender for an all-Wales approach, where we fund an organisation outside of the culture of local authorities to engage in communities, to get that raw data, to have the conversation with mothers with pushchairs and old men on walking sticks on what it would take to get them to change their travel behaviour and to build that in to the network maps. Because, after all, they're meant to be 15-year visions of, in an ideal world, what would need to be there for us to behave differently.
And that's not what local authorities did. The WLGA evidence to the committee was very clear: they did not want to create expectations they wouldn't be able to meet by putting routes into those maps that they weren't confident they could deliver. And that's the wrong starting point. So we've got to give them that confidence that we can create expectations, because without creating expectations, what's the point of doing this in the first place?But the lines that must be there have got to be lines that withstand scrutiny for creating networks that are going to be well used. So, I think, pressing the reset button by going out and doing a robust consultation exercise, targeting the right people, which will then put into the next maps in 2021 proper local networks that we can then fund in stages, to design standards by properly trained local authority officers, working regionally, scrutinising each other to make sure that the work is of a standard, alongside the crucial bit, which I haven't mentioned much today, which is promotion.
The focus of the budget is largely focused on capital, on infrastructure, and we know from all the evidence that as well as infrastructure we need behavioural change interventions. Some of the money that's being announced, the £30 million, is available to local authorities to do promotion, but we need to do much more if we're going to make this agenda take off. But let's reset the foundations, let's get that right, and then we can look at the next bit.

Jenny Rathbone AC: Thank you for your statement, Deputy Minister. What's clear to me is that in the context of the climate emergency we have now declared, this has to be everybody's business. You can't do it on your own, and I welcome the fact that you're going to offer training to officers in local authorities who are going to be taking on this new role, because it seems to me that one of the first stops should be in the planning department to ensure that we don't allow any new home developments or, indeed, business developments, unless we secure the active travel schemes to go with. But, obviously, most of the challenges come from retrofitting active travel into the streetscape that we've already got.
So, obviously, the most important statement last week was the First Minister's statement about 20 mph being the default for all areas, and it can't come soon enough in my constituency where, unfortunately, far too many motorists think that roads are for speeding on. In an urban area, that's completely unacceptable.
I also welcome the fact that you're focusing on people who don't walk or cycle because, obviously, we've got to have that cultural change, and focusing on these journeys to work, school and the shops that people do every day. So, in terms of engaging with all the other stakeholders, I just wondered how we're going to engage with schools and ensure that every single school has an active travel plan. Clearly, it will be very different in a rural area to an urban area, but if we don't support families to understand that there are active travel routes that they can more safely bring their children to school on than by condemning them, submitting them to going in a car, which is obviously much more dangerous, you know, it can be difficult for people who aren't themselves cyclists to know where the routes are. So, I'd like to know—I'm sure you don't necessarily know yourself—how many schools in Wales actually have an active travel plan, and what is the target we're going to set for achieving the vast majority of schools having an active travel plan.
Equally, we need to ensure that businesses are engaged in ensuring that their staff can arrive by bike or by—. They're not going to bring their bikes unless there's somewhere secure for them to park them, because otherwise they might not be there when they need to go home. Equally, obviously, children living three miles away from their school are entitled to free bus travel. What thought has been given in areas where there is public transport, like Cardiff, to ensuring that children are given free bus passes to travel on public transport, rather than these specialist buses that nobody else can use? It seems to me that there might be a way of incrementally increasing the number of buses available to everybody.
I suppose, lastly, one of my bugbears is to change the culture that encourages secondary school parents to pick up children from school. I can see long lines of them at the school where I'm a governor, and I simply cannot understand why any parent would not want to give their child the opportunity and the freedom to make their own way home, unless they're going on some special journey that requires them to be picked up.

Lee Waters AC: Thank you. A number of questions there I'll try to address. On the planning point, I think we took a big step forward in the late autumn, with the publication of the latest edition of 'Planning Policy Wales', which made some significant strengthening of the planning guidance for future developments on creating an active travel environment. It'll take some time, I guess, for that to work through, but I think we have made significant progress there.
In terms of schools, the education Minister and I had a number of conversations about this, and we both attended the last meeting of the cross-party group on active travel that Huw Irranca-Davies very helpfully chairs. It's a very good group that we find very useful to engage with. We heard some really good practice of the new Ysgol Gynradd Gymraeg Hamadryad in Grangetown, which is a fairly unusual school in the sense that it had a planning condition where no cars were allowed. They've done some terrific work there and Dr Dafydd Trystan, the chair of governors, and the headteacher there, Mrs Carbis, I think, have shown an inspirational example of what can be done—the role of leadership. But those are fairly unusual circumstances they found themselves in. So, how can we mainstream them? It shows that where there's a will, there is a way.
The conversation we're still working through is on the design of new schools that are currently within the twenty-first century schools project. The requirement is to provide facilities within the curtilage of the school, not without, and I think the trick to crack—and this is why we're resetting the maps and doing our planning properly—is that when we know that new schools are going to be built, it's not just down to the school builders to put facilities in place, though I think there is room for improvement there, but we need to make sure that the authorities themselves are building in the network of routes outside the curtilage of the school, so that when that school comes on stream those routes are there, going out into the whole community.
On your point on business—it's an important point—we have included some of this within the economic contract, but Dr Tom Porter, public health specialist at Cardiff and Vale health board, again showing the power of leadership, has done some very powerful work on discouraging staff from driving to work and to walk and cycle instead. The Cardiff and Vale health board, which is now mainstreaming that through the public services board for the other public sector employers, were able to show, using human resources data, the value to the whole workforce and the reduction of costs and sickness days lost from getting fewer people driving to work and more people walking and cycling. So, there are examples. As ever with all of this, the challenge is to spread and scale it.
On your final point, which is a challenging point about the journey to school and getting young people using public transport, I think it's a very well-made point. As we look at the future of buses White Paper, that's something we can consider. In terms of changing behaviour patterns, though, I think this is the key point I was making in the statement: if we start creating an environment where you've got well-designed routes, you've got more people using them, you start then to create a critical mass where it seems a normal and natural thing to do. My own reflection: when I started cycling again, having not cycled since being a teenager, in Cardiff probably about 15 years ago, it felt like a very eccentric thing to do. There weren't many people on a bike. Now, it seems like a fairly normal thing to do in Cardiff. In Llanelli, it's still a relatively eccentric thing to do. On the traffic-free paths, there are plenty of people cycling, but on the roads through town, I still feel a bit strange on the bike. There aren't many other people doing it. But it just goes to show that, over the period of a decade or so, you can create a culture of behaviour change, and that, by getting the foundations right, is what we need to do beyond Cardiff.

John Griffiths AC: I think many have made the point, Minister, that there is a lack of consistency across Wales, and you yourself have made that point. So, there is a need for more training, more capacity, more support for our local authorities. Substantial funding is available, although hopefully it will increase further, but to think of that funding and then hear you describe some of the use of that money, which is not really achieving the purposes of the active travel Act, I think will give everyone pause for thought, because we are tasked with making effective use of money. It's very, very important always, but perhaps even more so now in the current strained circumstances in which we all operate. So, providing that capacity building to make sure that the money is properly used and that we do get the benefits of the active travel Act, and get them as quickly as possible, must be an absolute priority. I really would like to see that level of consistency right across Walesin terms of the benefits that active travel brings.
Jenny mentioned 20 mph limits, Minister. I wonder if you could say a little bit more about that, because it does seem to me that the many benefits that 20 mph limits offer in our inner-urban areas are very conducive to active travel. If we do reduce the speed of vehicles through those areas, it does make active travel much more attractive, much more doable. So, I do think the two policies need to work in tandem. At the moment, local authorities face considerable costs in taking forward traffic orders for 20 mph limits. If that was turned on its head and there was a blanket 20 mph policy in these inner-urban areas right across Wales, and then they only took traffic orders forward for 30 mph speeds, I think that would actually offer quite a considerable cost saving, given the direction of travel that we need towards 20 mph, with all the benefits that it offers. So, I wonder if you could perhaps say a little bit about that.
And, finally, Transport for Wales obviously has a key role now in taking forward transport policy here in our country, and we need to make sure that, again, those linkages are made between active travel, our train services and, perhaps to a lesser extent, our bus services, just to make sure that everything is linked up, and that Transport for Wales is working with you as closely as possible to make sure that communication, joint working, synergies are achieved.

Lee Waters AC: Thank you. To take those two questions in reverse order—on Transport for Wales, the Member's absolutely right, and, as I said, I met with them yesterday, along with Sustrans, to see if we could encourage them to create a strategic partnership to make sure that we could deliver this in a way that was both integrated in terms of the package of train work that they're doing, and potentially bus work, to make sure active travel is absolutely mainstreamed in terms of the transport system, but also allowing, through working with Sustrans, a degree of challenge and help to local authorities to be able to do that effectively. So, that's very much on my mind and I'll be meeting them again in a month or so to follow that up.
On the point of 20 mph zones, I must pay tribute to John Griffiths for the advocacy work he's done in this Assembly, along with other Members, and also the work he did as the Minister who took through the active travel Act. His point on the default of 20 mph is a really important one. Currently, if you're in a local authority, and we've all, through constituency representation, had groups of people who want slower speeds in their area. It's the issue that's raised with me consistently when I have monthly public meetings—they don't like speed bumps, on the whole, they tend to divide opinion, but they do want slower speeds. And I think we need to move from the position where we see 30 as the default with a case to be made for 20, to being 20 as the default with a case to be made for 30. So, shifting that burden of proof, because, at the moment, we have a very complicated and expensive way of having to put through transport orders in order to bring in a 20 mph zone. So, I think we need to end the days of zones and start seeing 20 at the speed limit area-wide, and that then becomes self-reinforcing as speeds slow down. There still is an issue of police enforcement, which, I think, we're going to have to confront, but where it's working well, it is a largely self-reinforcing system.
The cost of that—I know there's some concern in local authorities about the practicalities of this, and this is why we're setting up this working group with the WLGA to work through the details. But the mandate we've given them is significant. It's not, 'Would you consider whether we should have more 20 mph zones?' The policy direction is: 'We want 20 mph as default, and we want you to work together to work through the practicalities of that to make it work for you, to make it practical and affordable, and to make sure the design is done so that it's effective.'And I was very pleased that Phil Jones, who led the work on the active travel design guidance, has agreed to chair that panel. I see it very much as an active travel intervention. Rod King, who John Griffiths brought to meet me some months ago, has also agreed to join the group. So, we have some good behaviour-change people around the table, and I also want to make sure we bring local authority leaders with us on this, because the intent is to help them to deliver the public health benefits that they are obliged to deliver and we all want to see. Public Health Wales have done an evidence review on this that shows the public health point of view: this is a no-brainer, but we need to work through the practicalities. The 20's Plenty for Us movement have claimed—and I have no reason to doubt it, but I've not seen the evidence—that a national speed limit will be eight times cheaper than individual authorities making 20 mph zones. So, that's the sort of thing we now need to work through while the group is being set up.

Joyce Watson AC: And, finally, Huw Irranca.

Huw Irranca-Davies AC: Thank you, acting Presiding Officer. Can I welcome the statement, but also the way it's being framed—that it's not simply on the promotion of cycling and walking, but it's in the context of the emergency that we have with climate change, it's with the obesity crisis that we have, and it's on the issues of air quality? Because I think that is the right context, and, actually, if we get this right, it is a complete win across all those agendas, and healthy living, and healthier lifestyles, and dealing with things like, in the Llynfi valley, where there's a 20-year lifespan difference between the top of the Llynfi valley and the bottom of the Llynfi valley. That's incredible, and part of this is what we're looking to deal with.
I very much welcome the focus on capacity because that's certainly the case in my own authority, which has got a good track record in active travel, but, unfortunately, Transport for Wales has stolen away the key individual who drove the active travel agenda, and we're struggling now, actually, to recruit the person with the right skills who isn't purely a highway engineer. So, I wonder what can be done to help those local authorities get those right people in place now, with the right skill set, that can develop active travel as well as understanding what engineers need as well, but can do the consultation and the community engagement. And on that basis, I wonder how do local authorities like Bridgend tap into the wider out-of-local-authority expertise that he's talking about developing in terms of this support across all local authorities for people who can do those consultations with people who don't currently travel by walking and cycling.
And my final question on this is: with some of the different approaches to funding that the Minister has laid out in his statement and in responses, would that include local authorities who were to come forward with proposals, for example, to develop more Ysgol Hamadryads, ones that not only built the infrastructure—as we've done in Pencoed recently with our twenty-first century schools—but then actually worked with schools to say, 'We're going to go further; we're going to affect the cultural change, working with parents, governors, local community, but we're also going to say to parents, "We will have a contract that says this is how you bring your child to school—not by car but by other means".' Would the money that's been made available, or would part of it, be actually there to inspire progressive local authorities to develop those sorts of things so we have not just one Ysgol Hamadryad but suddenly, by the end of this tranche, 30 or 40?

Lee Waters AC: Thank you for those questions, and, again, can I echo my comments about the dynamic role that he's playing as chair of the cross-party group? Because I think it does bring together not only people from different parties, because this is a cross-party agenda, but it brings the local authority people, along with the local campaigners, all in one room, where there is a will to make change happen. And I'm very keen to continue engaging with that group and to attend every meeting, if I'm able to.
In terms of the skills point, I think regional working is essential in this area. This is one area where it's going to be needs-led, and also, as Transport for Wales starts to develop its remit, I think there is a real role there for that central expertise to be held, so that local authorities can set the priorities, they can make the decisions on where the routes are, but then they can call on Transport for Wales to provide that expertise they're not able to carry themselves locally.
On the consultation element, that community engagement work, we will fund separately this time round to see how that works, and I think it'll be interesting to see if that does bring us a different result from the one that was brought last time. So, we need to keep that under review.
In terms of schools, then, we do have the active journeys programme that we've been funding and that Sustrans have been delivering. We're going to be putting out to tender a larger contract based on the same approach over the summer. But there is a role for local leadership as well, and it's not just for the Welsh Government and local authorities to lead this; individual schools need to do their bit as well, because all schools struggle with parking and drop-offs in the morning. It's a consistent problem in every school I visit in my constituency. And I sympathise with headteachers for the range of pressures they face as it is, but this is one that'll have immediate benefits for them if they're able to engage with it, and there are all sorts of tools available to help them.
In terms of the specific point of is the funding available to allow local authorities to take a more innovative approach, then, yes, it is. There is flexibility within the funding we've announced. If local authorities want to bring forward proposals for a more imaginative approach, they will find a sympathetic ear.

Joyce Watson AC: Thank you.

6. Debate: The Chief Medical Officer for Wales 2018-19 Annual Report—Valuing our Health

The following amendments have been selected: amendment 1 in the name of Rhun ap Iorwerth.

Joyce Watson AC: We're going to move on, now, to item 6, and we'll have a debate on the Chief Medical Officer for Wales's 2018-19 annual report, and I call on the Minister for Health and Social Services to move the motion—Vaughan Gething.

Motion NDM7048 Rebecca Evans
To propose that the National Assembly for Wales
1. Notes the Chief Medical Officer for Wales’s Annual Report for 2018-19 ‘Valuing our Health’ published on 7 May 2019 and in particular welcomes:
a) the CMO’s reflections on the achievements, opportunities and challenges which we face in improving the health of people in Wales;
b) his focus on the importance of achieving best value from the resources available in health care;
c) the importance of research to health improvement and the Welsh economy; and
d) his assessment of the major health threats we face.

Motion moved.

Vaughan Gething AC: Thank you, acting Deputy Presiding Officer. I'm happy to move the motion before us. The chief medical officer took up his post here in August 2016. He was attracted to come to Wales by the prudent healthcare agenda that we had set out upon. I have asked him to ensure that the prudent agenda does not stall, but continues to make a bigger, wider and more consistent difference, and therefore I'm very pleased to see that prudent healthcare, delivered more consistently by value-based healthcare, is at the very heart of his report, and I welcome the unique perspective that he brings.
Previous CMO reports have provided the opportunity to reflect on where Wales stands with regard to the health and well-being of our population, the challenges we face in public health and the changing provision of healthcare. Two years ago, the CMO report looked at how social disadvantage can impact on a person's life chances, their health and well-being. Last year's report examined the harms that gambling can cause to individuals, families and wider society. Those reports have informed our plans and approach to service transformation and delivery. This year, the CMO's report looks at three specific issues: prudent and value-based care; health and social care research; and health threats ranging from antimicrobial resistance to the environment.
The report also touches on the importance of getting children vaccinated against measles, mumps and rubella. Clinicians and other healthcare professionals have a responsibility to ensure that parents are fully informed of the benefits of vaccination. Members will be aware that this aspect of the report has already attracted considerable media coverage. We have worked hard to eliminate preventable childhood diseases and it should concern all of us that some parents continue to be taken in by anti-vaccination campaigns. So, I want to reiterate again the effectiveness and safety of the measles, mumps and rubella vaccination and urge parents to get their children vaccinated.
The report also considers the challenge of childhood obesity and the development of a healthy weight plan. My officials are currently considering the responses to the consultation that has recently closed, and that will inform what we hope will be a holistic approach. Members have heard today how assets such as the Wales coastal path can be promoted to help tackle obesity by providing enjoyable outdoor exercise and, of course, the role that active travel has to play. Members will be aware that there continues to be a high level of support for the principles of prudent healthcare. There are many examples across Wales of co-production, shared decision making, tackling inequality and variation and reducing harm. We now need to embed these principles much more effectively and consistently, not as part of good practice, but as part of standard and consistent practice.
The CMO is clear that a value-based care approach provides a route to making prudent healthcare much more of a practical, consistent reality. And that is an exciting prospect for our health and care system. It should allow our NHS to focus on doing more of the things that achieve better outcomes and a better experience with and for our people. We must be clear that looking at value in this way is not motivated by cutting costs. Rather, it is about equipping and incentivising health boards to use data to identify and then to disinvest in lower value actions and to reinvest that resource in those interventions that provide the best outcomes. A lot of good work has already started under the clinical leadership of Dr Sally Lewis and I have agreed to invest a further £0.5 million pounds in further developing value-based care here in Wales.
The report also highlights the importance of research and innovationin supporting not just better health,but also the way that our services are organised. It describes the rich history of research we have in Wales. Our modern-day research infrastructure is an essential part of the Welsh economy and educational landscape. The benefits of health and care research are profound, and its importance cannot be underestimated, whether that be in preventing ill health, enhancing well-being, reducing inequality or developing better treatment and shaping efficient and effective service organisation and delivery.

Vaughan Gething AC: That is why we've invested in Health and Care Research Wales to enable us to put in place resources and infrastructure to support that research community, industry and people here in Wales. What is happening in Wales today across various fields of health and social care research is something that we should be genuinely proud of. NHS Wales is on the cusp of realising the significant benefits that can be delivered by advances in precision medicine for patients by offering the right test or treatment at the right time. Our work on new genetic and genomic technology is allowing us to develop a much more detailed understanding of the link between our genes and our health, helping us to develop new, advanced therapies and person-centred treatment. The pace of change in this area is rapid. We continue to be a member of the UK Clinical Research Collaboration and the experimental and precision medicine funders group and to co-fund a number of precision medicine fellowships.
A flagship initiative here in Wales, HealthWise Wales, launched by the then Minister for public health to my left in her new role, is the largest study of its kind in Europe, with more than 30,000 people registered. The power of such a study to contribute towards our understanding of health, well-being and lifestyle choices is significant and it will no doubt be used in coming years to develop policy, services and treatments.
In addition, the secure anonymised information linkage databank, otherwise known as SAIL, based in Swansea University, brings together and links anonymised person-level data about the people of Wales. It provides this in a safe and secure way as a resource for conducting research. The data security and information governance that underpin the SAIL databank are internationally recognised as exemplars. The data resource is used to support a range of high-quality research projects in Wales and across the UK, including Dementias Platform UK, the multiple sclerosis register and the UK Biobank.
Now, there are too many research examples to mention in my brief contribution today, but, to give an example, the research done by the Wales National Centre for Population Health & Wellbeing Research, again based in Swansea, is at the forefront of research to inform obesity prevention initiatives, which, as we have discussed on more than one occasion, is a significant policy priority for us. Bangor University's research on family attitudes and experiences following the implementation of our groundbreaking Human Transplantation (Wales) Act 2013 is another good example of Welsh research informing and improving made-in-Wales policies.
We remain acutely aware, across the Government, of the challenges posed by Brexit, as we work to ensure safe passage for the future of health and care research in Wales, and to do so with a climate that continues to support our increasing success in research and wider prosperity.Finally, the CMO report looks at some of the health protection threats we face, including antimicrobial resistance, threats from diseases that are preventable, those that are communicable, and the changing environmental hazards that affect us all. These are serious issues that we must be prepared to tackle head on if we are to make progress and reduce the significant impact upon people's health and well-being.
We will continue to invest, therefore, in our national health protection service and infrastructure to ensure we remain resilient to the threats that we face. Members will know that antimicrobial resistance is a worldwide problem. In Wales, we must play our part in preventing infections as well as reducing the inappropriate use of antibiotics. The figures are heading the right direction here in Wales, but we must continue to both support and challenge our NHS and social care to meet the challenging targets that we have set. We are also working to eradicate hepatitis B and C as a significant threat to public health. The Welsh Government is committed to eradicate hepatitis by 2030, and our NHS is working hard to identify and treat people. The rise of sexually transmitted infections remains a matter of concern. The Welsh Government has accepted the recommendations of an independent review of sexual health services, which we've debatedpreviously here. The aim is to reduce infections, with improved services, education and better patient experience. We must also do what we can to counteract health threats in the environment, and Ministers share the CMO's assessment that an integrated approach is required to tackle air quality and other hazards.
In conclusion, I'd like to thank the chief medical officer, Dr Frank Atherton, for a thought-provoking report and recommendations. We will carefully consider it, and it will continue to challenge and inform our choices for the future health and well-being of our services and people here in Wales.

Joyce Watson AC: I have selected the amendment to the motion and I call on Dai Lloyd to move amendment 1, tabled in the name of Rhun ap Iorwerth.

Amendment 1—Rhun ap Iorwerth
Add new point at end of motion:
regrets the continued failure to bring forward legislation to tackle air pollution as a way of improving health.

Amendment 1 moved.

Dai Lloyd AC: Thank you very much, acting Chair, and I'm very pleased to contribute to this debate on an excellent report by the chief medical officer, and I move the amendment on air pollution. More on that in a moment.
In terms of time, the other point I was going to focus on was immunisation against MMR—a fundamentally important point that the Minister has already referred to. Our chapel in Swansea has an enormous cemetery, over four acres, and it's heartbreaking to see the graves of young children there. The cemetery has been there for two centuries. The names of very young children and babies are listed on the gravestones. They died in their hundreds over the years because of diphtheria, tetanus and a number of other diseases.
Back in 2012-13, when I was a full-time GP, a case of the measles arose—it started in Swansea—in my practice, in Cockett, where I was a partner at the time. The numbers that had received the immunisation against MMR weren't sufficient to prevent this disease from spreading. It does depend on herd immunity. It depends on the fact that 95 per cent of children can't catch measles because they have been immunised against it. The virus is still alive in our communities. It depends on the fact that 95 per cent, however, can't catch the virus because they have been immunised. There are a number of children who have particular conditions who can't receive the injection, so it is incumbent on all other people who are fit to receive this injection to have it.
Before immunisation against measles, thousands of children and young people caught measles every year here in the UK, and hundreds died from the condition or suffered continuing after-effects, such as deafness, throughout their lives. Now, with the advent of MMR in 1988, for several years nobody died from measles, and there were no cases at all of measles for many years, until recent years when levels of immunisation have fallen below 95 per cent, and sometimes significantly below 95 per cent. Back in Swansea, around seven years ago, the level was around 82 per cent, so there is little wonder that we had a number of cases of measles, with one death, unfortunately.
The other point that the chief medical officer makes in the report—there are a number of points, of course, but, because our amendment refers to air pollution, I will talk about that particular issue, which kills or contributes to the deaths of 2,000 people in Wales every year. We've heard from Lee Waters this afternoon that there is an air quality crisis here in Wales, and of course there is a climate emergency as well. And, of course, air pollution is a public health crisis, as the chief medical officer has outlined in the excellent report this afternoon.
So, we do need to take action urgently, particularly to decrease emissions from cars and lorries on our streets and roads. We need to legislate in this field, because it is a climate emergency and it is an emergency with regard to public health. I am the chair of the cross-party group on a clean air Act, created here at the Senedd, so that we can create clean air zones in our towns and cities. Our children deserve no less than that. We need the infrastructure for our counties to gather information on pollution in their areas. Air pollution is damaging to our lungs, and to our hearts now because nanoplastics—those tiny particles are so small now that they can reach our hearts through our veins and our blood vessels. Those nanoplastics are so small that they reach our hearts and they do cause heart disease. So, do support this amendment. Thank you.

Joyce Watson AC: I call on Janet Finch-Saunders.

Janet Finch-Saunders AC: Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd.Dr Frank Atherton has quite rightly outlined well the multiple issues that require all of our attention and, indeed, some Government action. He reminds us all of the importance of research, awareness and effective collaboration in order to tackle the major health threats facing us in Wales, and also to be prepared for expected health and social changes. Infections, environmental threats, rising obesity levels—particularly childhood obesity, with 27 per cent of children aged four to five now classed as overweight or obese—smoking-related deaths, and the ever-evolving needs of our ageing society are major causes of concern.
The recent levelling of life expectancy rates requires monitoring. Most concerning, however, is the variation between the most and least deprived areas of Wales, generally being an eight-year gap between economically secure households and less economically viable ones. In terms of healthy life expectancy, this variation increases to a momentous 18-year difference.
Crucially, as explored in chapter 1, care of the elderly population in Wales needs to be based on a whole-system approach that acknowledges the right for elderly people to age well, both physically and mentally. And it also takes into consideration the forecasted population increase by 58 per cent for those aged 75 and over. This is pivotal. As we are all aware, elderly people are most at risk of developing dementia—and that has been discussed earlier today—along with other illnesses such as cancer, which has become one of the most fatal and painful illnesses of our generation. This, however, should be considered alongside the fact that older people are more likely to experience complications from multiple health conditions, which can make diagnosis and treatment difficult.
Further, the medical officer outlines four recommendations so that our healthcare system and approach is both prudent and value driven. This includes a development of infrastructure, data, good practice and excellent communication. Now, I recognise that creating a data-driven system is integral to ascertaining where investment should be channelled to tackle the biggest health threats. Research is integral to the successful delivery of our health strategy and therefore I do urge the Welsh Government to continue funding such meaningful research, co-ordinating activity among key stakeholders and, where possible, to further engage the public in those various stages of research.
The Government should also look to promote the work of Health Wise Wales, which is now asking the public to share their thoughts on the most pressing health, well-being and social care questions as part of their national project. Indeed, Cancer Research UK’s report, ‘Bench to Bedside’, calls on the Welsh Government to drastically improve its funding for medical research, particularly quality-related research.More precisely, I wish to bring attention to Cancer Research UK’s calls that the Welsh Government innovates its strategic thinking and planning mechanisms to attract and support researchers with new funding opportunities. This is urgent in light of Brexit, as funding streams from the EU to UK medical research could be lost.
Deputy Presiding Officer, I encourage the Welsh Government to be proactive with other devolved nations, such as Scotland, in order to improve our knowledge, understanding and response to the health challenges affecting us today. Obesity is one of these, so I therefore welcome the introduction of the healthy weight plan. I hope that this will improve the current worrying statistics on fruit and vegetable consumption.
Finally, I believe that Dr Atherton has brought attention to less overt health threats, such as antimicrobial resistance, anti-vaccination trends, healthcare acquired infections, chemical contamination, and the effect of changes in our climate and natural environment, such as the release of radiation, flooding, and extreme weather variations.
The chief medical officer states that more work with GP practices is needed to ensure appropriate antibacterial use. Similarly, schools should continue to be encouraged to provide both MMR vaccinations to children so that the current percentage rates of those being vaccinated rise. I am keen to ask the Welsh Government what plans are in place to improve the uptake of vaccinations in harder-to-reach demographics. I uphold Dr Atherton's recommendations and urge the Government to act on this most interesting and robust report so that we can continue to protect the health of Welsh people and deliver our healthcare aims. Thank you.

Mick Antoniw AC: Minister, I'd like to refer specifically to the part of the report in the annex that is dealing with the progress that's been made in respect of the public health issue that's been raised with regard to gambling. I raise it because last year's report was a groundbreaking report and has been recognised throughout the UK in identifying and starting the process of looking at how we tackle what is, I think, a latent, growing, hidden and emerging but incredibly serious epidemic.
I have to say that, although there are aspects of the annex in terms of work that has been done that I welcome, I think it is not enough by any stretch of the imagination. I certainly welcome the survey questions to young people with regard to prevalence, the consideration of looking at the planning system, raising concerns about advertising with the standards authority, seminars and so on. But I don't think this, by any stretch of the imagination, recognises the actual scale of the public health issues with regard to gambling.
Certainly, much of the responsibility in respect of gambling is at UK level, but certainly there is much that we can do in respect of the public health aspects. If I can just refer the Minister and the Members to a leading market research company's comments on gambling:
'Global sports betting market expected to reach approximately $155 billion by 2024...growing at a healthy 8.83 per cent...with digital revolution transforming the world every second, the sports betting market is likely to grow dynamically in the future.'
If we actually look at the state of gambling and its impact within Wales, the Gambling Commission estimates that 1.1 per cent of the Welsh population are problem gamblers. That is approximately 40,000 people. It estimates that there are a further 4 per cent at risk—that is, a further 160,000 people—and for every one problem gambler, research estimates that a further seven are adversely affected. That is a further 280,000 people, and I think those are extremely conservative estimates based on old information and do not reflect the scale of what is happening.
I chair the cross-party group on gambling and we've had some very interesting academics who've been doing research in various countries, particularly Australia, identifying some of the impacts on young people, and it is the young people that I think we must particularly look at in terms of our public health policy, and I don't think the report actually really does start getting to grips. Eighty per cent of 11 to 16-year-olds have seen gambling adverts on tv, 70 per cent have seen gambling adverts on social media, and 66 per cent on websites. Seventy-eight per cent of young people we spoke to think betting has become a normal part of sport, and this normalisation of the association with gambling and sport I think is incredibly significant. It has become part of the culture of sport and it should worry us considerably.
I was looking at the programme of the new Tottenham Hotspur White Hart Lane stadium recently—the £1 billion stadium, which is fantastic—and the first thing that jumped out was the statement that there would be no gambling facilities within the stadium. I thought, 'That's impressive', alongside its recycling policy, until of course you read that there is internet throughout the stadium. Betting outlets are no longer necessary. It is the internet gambling. And when you look at the actual amount of money that's ploughed in, let's be honest about it, gambling is the new nicotine, the new tobacco industry of sport. That is why we need to seriously tackle the issue of public education.
Three in five students have gambled in some way over the past 12 months. One in 10 have used all or some of their student loan to gamble. Minister, the scale is phenomenal and it is growing. In the UK alone, it is a £15 billion industry, and growing year by year. We all know that you cannot turn on satellite, you cannot turn on the internet, on your phones, on YouTube—anything that you utilise—the extent to which there is gambling advertising. And of course, that is within the UK responsibility, and, of course, we have to engage because there is a desperate need for new gambling legislation that seriously tackles and restricts that.
But in the meantime, in terms of what we have within our competence, I think we actually need a very, very clear and dynamic strategy that is up to the scale of the gambling epidemic that is approaching and is already hitting and indoctrinating our young people. It needs to be one of public education. There has to be far greater focus on how we can use planning laws in terms of outlets, how we can look at outlets in respect of advertising themselves, and also, ultimately, the pressure that we have to put onto the gambling industry and the gambling commission for the proper funding of what is needed to tackle gambling addiction and gambling education.
What is happening at the moment—

Joyce Watson AC: Can you bring your remarks to a close, please?

Mick Antoniw AC: What is happening at the moment is mere peanuts and I don't think the strategy we have at the moment is a strategy or in any way adequate to dealwith what we could, potentially, be doing.

Caroline Jones AC: I thank the chief medical officer for his latest annual report. Dr Atherton has highlighted several health challenges facing our nation. I want to focus my contribution on two of those challenges. Two challenges to our nation’s health that, if left unchecked, could do untold damage to the well-being of Wales. Those challenges are antimicrobial resistance and the spread of the 'anti-vax' movement.
I welcome that, as highlighted by the chief medical officer, there has been progress made in reducing inappropriate use of antibiotics in health settings. However, we can’t tackle antimicrobial resistance by just reducing the number of antibiotics handed out by our GPs. We have been overusing broad-spectrum antibiotics for decades. When we take an antibiotic, a percentage of it ends up going down the toilet, and a result, a large amount of antibiotics ends up in our waste streams, our rivers and oceans. This pharmaceutical pollution does not only have an adverse impact upon wildlife; it also adds to the pool of microorganisms that are drug resistant. We also must consider the impact that agricultural use of antibiotics is having. Concentrations of antibiotics in soil can approach the therapeutic doses given to livestock because of overuse.
We have seen several cases around the world during the last few years were bacterial infections were resistant to every antibiotic in the arsenal. Infections for which there is no cure is a clear and present danger to human life. We must act to reduce opportunities for these microbes to become resistant and to find alternatives, and that means that as well as reducing human use of antibiotics, we also must tackle overuse in agriculture and stamp out pharmaceutical pollution. We must also invest in research into alternatives to antibiotics such as bacteriophages.
As well as the threats we face from bacteria, we are seeing a growing threat from viruses that were once under control. Again, it is human behaviour that is the driving force behind the threat. This time it’s not the arsenal that is failing. Lies and misinformation have led many to abandon the arsenal altogether. The growth of the 'anti-vax' movement has skyrocketed thanks to social media. While the social media companies are finally acting, it’s too little, too late. Too many parents have listened to the lies spread by the likesof disgraced former doctor Andrew Wakefield and American actress Jenny McCarthy. The end result of those lies is the death of children from measles.
The number of measles outbreaks has increased in recent years and we are seeing more than 10 per cent of children failing to receive two doses of the MMR vaccine. We must actively combat the spread of 'anti-vax' propaganda online with our own stark messages. Unvaccinated children may die because some person online convinced a parent that vaccines cause autism. Vaccines prevent death from disease. We all have a role to play in highlighting this, and I thank Dr Atherton for including the threat from vaccine-preventable disease in his annual report. Diolch yn fawr.

Huw Irranca-Davies AC: Can I also thank the chief medical officer for the report? It's curious that we've had an afternoon where we've debated some elements that appear within this report—the issue of behavioural change and active lifestyles, whether it's through active travel or elsewhere. We're very cognisant of the fact as well that 'A Healthier Wales', the strategy that the Minister laid out last year and that he's driving forward, gives us that opportunity to transform healthcare in the way we look at it. A real transformational and generational change towards prevention and community and primary care, prudent healthcare, to people living longer and independently at or closer to home and so on. I'd urge the Minister, because I know his commitment on this, to continue to drive this change with partners right across Wales and make this transformation and make it irreversible.
But I want to turn to something else entirely, a different way to view this, and for this I'm grateful to the Equality and Human Rights Commission for their submission to all Assembly Members, which I'm going to draw extensively on and I'm sure the Minister will have seen it too. They draw on their report earlier this year, 'Is Wales Fairer?', and they report the key findings from that report, the particular challenges, the entrenched issues that affect the Gypsy/Roma/Traveller communities, not least in terms of their access to health provision. But also the mistrust and the reluctant uptake of health services is still a major issue.
The fact that amongst non-disabled people when they report good health it's almost twice as frequent as disabled people, and disabled people report poor mental health nearly three times more frequently than non-disabled people. The fact that up to one in five women are affected by perinatal mental illness and still face the challenges within Wales of access to specialist perinatal mental health services.
And of course as we all know the challenges for looked-after children, who tend to be at greater risk of experiencing poor mental health than children in the wider population. We all know too well that men in Wales, from statistics in 2016, are four times more likely than women to die by suicide. The challenges that we have not just in Wales but across the UK and across many developed nations in terms of matching the provision for mental health with the rise in demand.
Finally, they point out that one of the greatest challenges is the lack of disaggregated data meaning that it's hard to actually identify the outcomes and do the analysis of the potential barriers in access to healthcare for those with specific protected characteristics. So, they do make some specific recommendations, and again I'll touch on them very briefly here.
First, that in taking forward 'A Healthier Wales', the overarching strategy now of Welsh Government in terms of transforming health, equality and human rights are absolutely embedded within its implementation. So, those points that I refer to in a moment, that those are recognised but that equality and human rights are deeply embedded within that strategy.
That healthcare in Wales is accessible to all without discrimination, and that's with particular reference to Gypsies and Roma and Travellers, to the accessibility and quality of translation services that are available to migrants and refugees and asylum seekers, and that there is a fully integrated gender identity service in Wales where you can monitor the impact on health outcomes for transgender people within Wales. And also that we fully evaluate progress made under the Mental Health (Wales) Measure 2010and the 'Together for Mental Health' strategy.
Now, we are doing some incredible things in Wales, despite the challenges in funding and the wider challenges within healthcare, but it is right that we constantly challenge ourselves to do more, and I hope the Minister will welcome the analysis and the challenges laid down by the Equality and Human Rights Commission as actually a useful contribution to doing things better as we go forward.

The Llywydd took the Chair.

I call on the Minister for Health and Social Services to reply to the debate—Vaughan Gething.

Vaughan Gething AC: Thank you, Presiding Officer, and I want to thank Members for their largely thoughtful contributions to today's debate. I want to thank Dai Lloyd for his speech and, in particular, reiterating the point that was taken up by some other Members about the importance of vaccination—his own direct experience as a GP, but also parents like myself who have gone and made sure that our children are vaccinated—and the points made about the fact that the conspiracy theories about vaccination continue to be promoted. The current occupant of the White House has taken his turn in trying to do exactly the same thing, and then taken a step back, but it's important that we all have a consistent message about the importance of doing so.
I want to turn to Mick Antoniw's contribution. I, too, share your concern about the normalisation of the link between gambling and sport. Sport is such a wide-scale activity, with so many people involved and engaged, we can't protect our children and young people from seeing the pervasive messages there around professional sport, and, indeed, adults, and it does have an influence. People don't advertise the opportunities to gamble freely just for the sake of their own conscience, that they think it's a good thing to do, they advertise it because it has an impact and it draws people in. That's why the chief medical officer has directly engaged with the Advertising Standards Agency and why we continue to do so. And I recognise that there are challenges in this area. The work we're currently doing with directors of public health, the work that we're doing bringing together a range of stakeholders, we set out some of the detail in the report, but we do agree that an integrated approach with other policy areas, like substance misuse, is required to provide an initial framework for action. So, we will continue to look at how we maximise our opportunity to make a difference, bearing in mind not all of the powers we would like to have rest within this place.
There was much of what Janet Finch-Saunders said that I wouldn't disagree with, but I would say that, any time people call for an increase in a budget, they can't expect to be taken seriously unless they say where that money will come from. We are in an environment where there is less money available. The health service gains the largest share of that. So, if we're going to call for extra money, let's be clear about where that will come from and what that means—either to call for an increase in the budget provided to this place in the first place, or to set out which areas people prefer to see cut to do so.
And, on Huw Irranca-Davies's points, I'm more than happy to agree with him on the point about mental health, but also more generally the point about equity in the delivery of health care, recognising the challenges that particular groups of people have in having a genuinely fair service from our health service. And I do agree that the report from the Equality and Human Rights Commission is a helpful reminder for us across the whole service.I'm also, of course, happy to reiterate my commitment to deliver the vision set out in 'A Healthier Wales', to do better, to improve the experience and the outcomes across a range of measures, because that is what the people of Wales deserve.
I won't repeat many of the points that I've already made on a number of occasions about the challenges that lie ahead of us, however it is helpful to consider the CMO's report and his recommendations as part of the solution. So, we're looking generally to deliver on the promise of prudent healthcare through value-based healthcare. That is something that would be of great benefit to all of us, to unlock significant resource within our system and to direct that towards better outcomes.
I would, therefore, in ending, Presiding Officer, like to thank, again, the chief medical officer for his analysis and recommendations, and I look forward to his continued advice, challenge and support as we move forward with improving health and social care services and shaping a healthier and happier Wales.

The proposal is to agree amendment 1. Does any Member object? [Objection.] I will defer voting until voting time.

7. Voting Time

And that brings us to voting time. The only vote this afternoon is the vote on the debate on the Chief Medical Officer for Wales's annual report, and I call for a vote on amendment 1,tabled in the name of Rhun ap Iorwerth. Open the vote. Close the vote. In favour 15, no abstentions, 27 against. And therefore, the amendment is not agreed.

NDM7048 - Amendment 1: For: 15, Against: 27, Abstain: 0
Amendment has been rejectedClick to see vote results

I now call for a vote on the motion unamended, tabled in the name of Rebecca Evans. Open the vote. Close the vote. In favour 43, no abstentions, none against. Therefore, the motion is agreed.

NDM7048 - Debate: The Chief Medical Officer for Wales 2018-19 Annual Report – Valuing our Health - Motion without amendment: For: 43, Against: 0, Abstain: 0
Motion has been agreedClick to see vote results

Thank you. That brings today's proceedings to a close.

The meeting ended at 17:50.

QNR

Questions to the First Minister

Hefin David: Will the First Minister provide an update on Welsh Government plans for agricultural pollution and regulatory reform?

Mark Drakeford: We aim to reform regulations by 2020 to prevent agricultural pollution, requiring farm businesses to undertake nutrient management planning, prohibiting polluting activities, minimising regulatory complexity and improving the enforcement capabilities of the regulator. We also support the industry by improving advice and guidance and providing financial assistance.

Janet Finch-Saunders: Will the First Minister make a statement on flood alleviation in the Conwy Valley?

Mark Drakeford: We have invested nearly £9 million in flood alleviation schemes in the Conwy valley over the last 10 years. We have also committed funding to support the development of potential future schemes in this area, prioritising funding towards reducing risk to homes in our most at risk communities.

Dawn Bowden: What recent discussions has the First Minister held with the UK Government over the operation of the probation service in Wales?

Mark Drakeford: The operation of the probation service is not currently devolved to Wales. However, we are working with the UK Government to ensure that Wales’s interests are reflected in the proposed changes to the probation service.